Help me decide on a sub& combo!
July-6th-2003, 01:56 AM
#33
Smoking or Non-Smoking???
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Philly
Posts: 731
take the time and do it yourself then, usually for large cuts where you can't get a 'plunge' type cut, just drill out a hole a little from the edge of the circle you're cutting out and then just use your jig-saw from there. maybe not as fast as a rotozip, but if your hole is traced accurately, and you don't get that nice burnt pine smell smoking towards your face 
, it should give you a nice flawless cut. good luck
peace
, it should give you a nice flawless cut. good luckpeace
July-6th-2003, 10:41 PM
#34
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
Originally posted by blue LEDz
also, the AXA 500M is definitely worth checking out. it will give you more power, over 500 watts, cause it's rated at 12.5 volts, not 14.4 like the alpine. and it has an extremely high dampening factor, >750
it won't be the most efficient amp, cause it's a class A/B, though. or you could look at the tsunami DB1100. it's $260, and is very versitile.
here are the specs for the alpine M300:
power at 12 volts with 1% THD
@4 ohm = 100 watts
@2 ohm = 200 watts
power at 14.4 volts with 1% THD
@4 ohm = 150 watts
@2 ohm = 300 watts
you lose 1/3 of the power when the voltage drops.
all that for $330
or for $260 you can have an amp that puts out more power, and at lower distortion. here's the specs on the DB1100:
1x330 at 4 ohm with .05% THD
1x650 at 2 ohm with .1% THD
1x1100 at 1 ohm with .5% THD
so even at full power the amp puts out less distortion than the alpine. you could easily run one K-series sub at 4 ohm off the amp. or you could run 2 at 2 ohm, or really crank a set of subs at 1 ohm, if you have the desire down the road. the amp will be able to push pretty much any sub you'd want in the future.
ok, i'm done
also, the AXA 500M is definitely worth checking out. it will give you more power, over 500 watts, cause it's rated at 12.5 volts, not 14.4 like the alpine. and it has an extremely high dampening factor, >750
it won't be the most efficient amp, cause it's a class A/B, though. or you could look at the tsunami DB1100. it's $260, and is very versitile. here are the specs for the alpine M300:
power at 12 volts with 1% THD
@4 ohm = 100 watts
@2 ohm = 200 watts
power at 14.4 volts with 1% THD
@4 ohm = 150 watts
@2 ohm = 300 watts
you lose 1/3 of the power when the voltage drops.
all that for $330
or for $260 you can have an amp that puts out more power, and at lower distortion. here's the specs on the DB1100:
1x330 at 4 ohm with .05% THD
1x650 at 2 ohm with .1% THD
1x1100 at 1 ohm with .5% THD
so even at full power the amp puts out less distortion than the alpine. you could easily run one K-series sub at 4 ohm off the amp. or you could run 2 at 2 ohm, or really crank a set of subs at 1 ohm, if you have the desire down the road. the amp will be able to push pretty much any sub you'd want in the future.
ok, i'm done
The AXA 500m or the Tsunami DB1100? This is the last step of the process. Can you help me decide which one to get?
The Tsunami seems to be more powerful and more versatile. It's class D, which is what I'd prefer... So, why should I consider the Avionixx amp instead?
Isn't the Tsunami waayyy too powerful for my sub? It's rated at 650Wrms @ 2ohms while the sub is only 300Wrms. Isn't it going to BLOW? So.. what now?
July-7th-2003, 12:39 AM
#35
**Punani Lover**
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Hawaii (duh!)
Posts: 1,861
the tsunami's from ed don't carry an extended warranty. they are a bunch of amps (made by avionixx build house) which tsunami did not want to use, so edesigns and avionixx decided to seel them off the site for real cheap, basically this:
since u prefer the class d and if ur okay with the 6 month warranty, then i'd say go for it. can never have too much power. 
seeing as ur sub will be dual 4, if ur afraid of overpowering the sub (tho ben claims the k's can handle 600wrms) u don't have to run it at 2ohms.
i personally don't think ur gonna blow the sub.
just don't go booming around all the time and u'll be fine.
if u decide to upgrade ur subs (and u will), u won't have to upgrade ur amp.
Because Tsunami has chosen not to sell the amplifiers they contracted the company to build Avionixx has contacted us to help clear the warehouse so to speak. The Tsunami amplifiers come with a 6 month warranty against factory defect from Elemental Designs. These amplifiers are NOT covered in any way shape or form by the company Tsunami or any of it's subsidiaries.
seeing as ur sub will be dual 4, if ur afraid of overpowering the sub (tho ben claims the k's can handle 600wrms) u don't have to run it at 2ohms.i personally don't think ur gonna blow the sub.
just don't go booming around all the time and u'll be fine.
if u decide to upgrade ur subs (and u will), u won't have to upgrade ur amp.
July-7th-2003, 12:52 AM
#36
Smoking or Non-Smoking???
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Philly
Posts: 731
if worried about overpowering, just turn your gains down, or just got with the 4 ohm load as we were saying and buy the single voice coil series. personally, you can never have too much power, just a matter of how you use that extra power i guess.
peace
peace
July-7th-2003, 05:59 PM
#37
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
The only reason I prefer Class D amps is because they are more efficient (that's what I heard). This means that I will have less problems with dimming lights, AC not working when the music is at full blast, etc...
What am I supposed to do?
Mr. blue LEDz, do you have anything to say?
What am I supposed to do?
Mr. blue LEDz, do you have anything to say?
July-7th-2003, 06:03 PM
#38
get orvillized! WTF?
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: I am here --> x
Posts: 948
Originally posted by demoninvictus
if worried about overpowering, just turn your gains down, or just got with the 4 ohm load as we were saying and buy the single voice coil series. personally, you can never have too much power, just a matter of how you use that extra power i guess.
peace
if worried about overpowering, just turn your gains down, or just got with the 4 ohm load as we were saying and buy the single voice coil series. personally, you can never have too much power, just a matter of how you use that extra power i guess.
peace
MiStErT
July-7th-2003, 06:07 PM
#39
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
Originally posted by MisterT
Well said and having the extra power and the gains properly adjusted, you eliminate the amount of distortion that is particularly bad for a speaker. You can blow a 450 watt sub with only 50 watts if your amp is distorting. Unless you are driving a pair of 8's with a SoundStream Tarantula (roughly 2000 watts RMS), I wouldn't be too concerned with the power rating. As far as the subs, you won't be disappointed. They sound really good!
MiStErT
Well said and having the extra power and the gains properly adjusted, you eliminate the amount of distortion that is particularly bad for a speaker. You can blow a 450 watt sub with only 50 watts if your amp is distorting. Unless you are driving a pair of 8's with a SoundStream Tarantula (roughly 2000 watts RMS), I wouldn't be too concerned with the power rating. As far as the subs, you won't be disappointed. They sound really good!
MiStErT
I am currently building the enclosure. I had my birthday yesterday, and I was out all day - celebrating.
It turns out that I don't have a compass (lost!), so I'm going out to get one, and I'll cut the hole for the sub. Here's the box so far:
Last edited by Intruder; July-7th-2003 at 07:43 PM.
July-8th-2003, 12:15 PM
#41
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
Originally posted by MisterT
Okay Squidword (SpongeBob is a trip). I see you are using the box recommended from their site. Looks great! Happy belated birthday too!
MiStErT
Okay Squidword (SpongeBob is a trip). I see you are using the box recommended from their site. Looks great! Happy belated birthday too!
MiStErT
July-8th-2003, 02:50 PM
#42
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
I've just finished cutting the hole. My first try (ever!) wasn't nearly as good as the second one, which IMO was perfect.
I've got one question now. At which point am I supposed to cover the box with carpet? After I finish building the whole thing or ... when? That must be common sense, but I have no idea!
I'm ready to buy the sub and an amp, but I need to know how much more inefficient the A/B class amps are compared to the class D amps...
I've got one question now. At which point am I supposed to cover the box with carpet? After I finish building the whole thing or ... when? That must be common sense, but I have no idea!
I'm ready to buy the sub and an amp, but I need to know how much more inefficient the A/B class amps are compared to the class D amps...
July-8th-2003, 04:14 PM
#43
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
Can you explain more in depth what the dampening factor relates to, or at least point me to a site where I can read about it? I don't understand what it measures actually. What makes the Avionixx amp have a dampening factor of >750? Is that 750 Watts? lol
And how much of a difference does 30% make? In real life terms... There is a 30% greater chance that my lights will dim, is that right? Should I be concerned about a 30% difference?
Thank you! I'm almost there!
What makes the Avionixx amp have a dampening factor of >750? Is that 750 Watts? lolAnd how much of a difference does 30% make? In real life terms... There is a 30% greater chance that my lights will dim, is that right? Should I be concerned about a 30% difference?
Thank you! I'm almost there!
July-8th-2003, 04:22 PM
#44
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 456
Hmm... Why are we discussing the efficiency of the amp? Isn't the total power consumption what decides whether my lights will dim? An amp being more efficient means that more of that total power consumption is pumped through the driver instead of being lost through heat or whatever else...
Then on the other hand, a less efficient amp with the same power rating will draw the same amount of power, but pump out less energy through the driver. Isn't that right?
If the two amps - one class A/B, the other class D - have the same power rating, there shouldn't be ANY difference in the amount of dimming that occurs. Is this correct?
Then on the other hand, a less efficient amp with the same power rating will draw the same amount of power, but pump out less energy through the driver. Isn't that right?
If the two amps - one class A/B, the other class D - have the same power rating, there shouldn't be ANY difference in the amount of dimming that occurs. Is this correct?
July-8th-2003, 05:45 PM
#45
get orvillized! WTF?
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: I am here --> x
Posts: 948
My lights dim noticably because I am using pure class A amps which are excellent in sound quality, but suck *** on efficiency. Class A amps draw more current from the battery more than any other amplifier. I guess that is the cost for sound quality. At the same time, my amp running the highs isn't the problem, it's the one running the lows! I have two EDesign 12k.44 wired at a 1 ohm load which the amp can handle, but my alternator is having a time keeping up. I will hopefully have time to correct this problem this weekend. I am upgrading the power wires to the alternator from the battery and am upgrading the battery's ground wire. If that doesn't work then I'll go with a ground kit.
In your case, you shouldn't need any of this. I would opt for a "D" class amp for your sub or subs if you get more in the future. The A/B is plenty efficient for your highs. It's just the subs draw so much current for them to move more cone area which sucks up some current from your electrical system. In a previous set up, I didn't have the same problem, but for some reason, I am with the Protege. The stiffening cap was sufficient enough in both previous installs with the same basic set up. I did have to replace batteries in both cases though eventually.
You can go to sites like SoundDomain and Crutchfield to learn more on the terms of amplification. Also, www.the12volt.com may have some useful information. At least nowadays you can ask and not feel like an idiot. Where I used to work in the mid 90's, you had to know everything about everything or you were treated like an idiot. I once was interested in becoming an installer, but was turned off from the local shops including the one that I worked for. They certainly were not mentors by a long shot.
MiStErT
In your case, you shouldn't need any of this. I would opt for a "D" class amp for your sub or subs if you get more in the future. The A/B is plenty efficient for your highs. It's just the subs draw so much current for them to move more cone area which sucks up some current from your electrical system. In a previous set up, I didn't have the same problem, but for some reason, I am with the Protege. The stiffening cap was sufficient enough in both previous installs with the same basic set up. I did have to replace batteries in both cases though eventually.
You can go to sites like SoundDomain and Crutchfield to learn more on the terms of amplification. Also, www.the12volt.com may have some useful information. At least nowadays you can ask and not feel like an idiot. Where I used to work in the mid 90's, you had to know everything about everything or you were treated like an idiot. I once was interested in becoming an installer, but was turned off from the local shops including the one that I worked for. They certainly were not mentors by a long shot.
MiStErT