Knocking bad
June-17th-2006, 10:05 AM
#16
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by 671_p5
Time to get reading
I would instal a Intake manifold thermal spacer at the same time, seing as your going to have it off and all.
http://www.nsnmotorsports.com/Protege/Engine.html
Last edited by FUMacDaddySlomo; June-17th-2006 at 10:10 AM.
June-17th-2006, 10:39 AM
#18
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by 671_p5
You think I would see much gain from my p5 since it is n/a?
You wont see any gains really from the spacer, but minimize the loss from the engine getting hot.
I track my car so I look for all I can get, and whith the manifold being off, Its a great oportunity to throw in some added benifits.
It will also feel good with the VTCS removed, it causes that iritating sound at start up & restrict flow a bit. even better if you port it a bit.
June-17th-2006, 10:46 AM
#19
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Hehe sorry for all the questions. . . but I have another one. Do you know if the IAT sensor robs hp? I've noticed a pretty big difference after taking it out. While shifting my car pulls real good. But when the sensor is on the pull is so smooth I can barely noticed it shifted.
June-17th-2006, 11:17 AM
#20
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Posts: 11
Thats a good question.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
June-17th-2006, 11:21 AM
#21
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Actually I wasnt trying to do anything. . . lol I don't know too much detail into engines just the basics. I was just putting in my generic mushroom filter and had no place to put the IAT sensor so I just unplugged it and was like wow all this power from a filter? But when I put it back in felt same as before.( The sensor that is)
June-17th-2006, 11:23 AM
#22
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Originally Posted by FUMacDaddySlomo
Thats a good question.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
June-17th-2006, 11:38 AM
#23
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by 671_p5
Actually I wasnt trying to do anything. . . lol I don't know too much detail into engines just the basics. I was just putting in my generic mushroom filter and had no place to put the IAT sensor so I just unplugged it and was like wow all this power from a filter? But when I put it back in felt same as before.( The sensor that is)
However when you go WOT the ECU goes into a form of closed loop, where it takes the sensor imputs and uses preset maps that are CRAZY rich.
The ECU goes into closed loop form at different times depending on the conditions (Throttle position, speed, gear, rpm, ect)
During closed loop the N/A 2.0L runs a tad lean, arround 9/1 AFR, and when in open loop she runs rich, arround 17/1 to 19/1 AFR. we want as close to14/1 as possible at any point.
The ECU on this motor is a tough nut to crack, getting less fuel during open loop has proven to be a chore short of engine management, but the stated trick (Pulling the FPR Vacume) adds some fuel during open loop giving a bit of benifits.
Unfortunatly I havnt got a A/F guage so I cant see the exact increase in fuel, & The 14 second N/A P5, is on a new set up with engine management (Microtech LT8S)
IF pulling the IAT sensor gives more fule in closed loop you would feel a bit quicker before going into open loop. IF It makes it run rich in open loop then you would be a bit slower when it kicks in, BUT it could have absolutly no impact on open loop, or even make the ECU run a leaner map, that would be benificial.
I should have a A/F guage this summer, so Ill be able to let you know whats going on then, unless somebody who has one already would want to run some test.
Last edited by FUMacDaddySlomo; June-17th-2006 at 11:42 AM.
June-17th-2006, 11:54 AM
#25
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Posts: 28
Originally Posted by FUMacDaddySlomo
Basically during closed loop the ECU uses all its sensors to adjust fuel ect.
However when you go WOT the ECU goes into a form of closed loop, where it takes the sensor imputs and uses preset maps that are CRAZY rich.
The ECU goes into closed loop form at different times depending on the conditions (Throttle position, speed, gear, rpm, ect)
During closed loop the N/A 2.0L runs a tad lean, arround 9/1 AFR, and when in open loop she runs rich, arround 17/1 to 19/1 AFR. we want as close to14/1 as possible at any point.
The ECU on this motor is a tough nut to crack, getting less fuel during open loop has proven to be a chore short of engine management, but the stated trick (Pulling the FPR Vacume) adds some fuel during open loop giving a bit of benifits.
Unfortunatly I havnt got a A/F guage so I cant see the exact increase in fuel, & The 14 second N/A P5, is on a new set up with engine management (Microtech LT8S)
IF pulling the IAT sensor gives more fule in closed loop you would feel a bit quicker before going into open loop. IF It makes it run rich in open loop then you would be a bit slower when it kicks in, BUT it could have absolutly no impact on open loop, or even make the ECU run a leaner map, that would be benificial.
I should have a A/F guage this summer, so Ill be able to let you know whats going on then, unless somebody who has one already would want to run some test.
However when you go WOT the ECU goes into a form of closed loop, where it takes the sensor imputs and uses preset maps that are CRAZY rich.
The ECU goes into closed loop form at different times depending on the conditions (Throttle position, speed, gear, rpm, ect)
During closed loop the N/A 2.0L runs a tad lean, arround 9/1 AFR, and when in open loop she runs rich, arround 17/1 to 19/1 AFR. we want as close to14/1 as possible at any point.
The ECU on this motor is a tough nut to crack, getting less fuel during open loop has proven to be a chore short of engine management, but the stated trick (Pulling the FPR Vacume) adds some fuel during open loop giving a bit of benifits.
Unfortunatly I havnt got a A/F guage so I cant see the exact increase in fuel, & The 14 second N/A P5, is on a new set up with engine management (Microtech LT8S)
IF pulling the IAT sensor gives more fule in closed loop you would feel a bit quicker before going into open loop. IF It makes it run rich in open loop then you would be a bit slower when it kicks in, BUT it could have absolutly no impact on open loop, or even make the ECU run a leaner map, that would be benificial.
I should have a A/F guage this summer, so Ill be able to let you know whats going on then, unless somebody who has one already would want to run some test.
June-17th-2006, 12:03 PM
#27
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 28
Originally Posted by FUMacDaddySlomo
Thats a good question.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
I would assume your trying to get more fuel during closed loop before going into open loop.
I will have to check that out, because if it makes the mixture richer during open loop as well as in closed loop, its a bad thing to not have it installed corectly, and uninstaling it is not doing any good. We are already rich during open loop.
I have a quick trick to get a little more fuel during closed loop that doesnt affect open loop at all.
Pull the FPR vacume line its behind the valve cover on the pass side, it will add a little fuel in closed loop. This comes from the 14 second N/A P5.
June-17th-2006, 12:18 PM
#28
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by 671_p5
I hope that p5 gets to the 12 second bracket. We have a k20 n/a on guam running low 12's be nice to see some good protege's out there too.
Pretty sure proporly tuned it could get into the 13's, I couldnt see 12's out of her. On the other hand there is a 197whp N/A FSDE 2.0L Protege Sedan who is also running 14's with trap speeds arround 97mph, That is a project in the works, and we are seing what can be done with her,as she goes.
Unfortunatly The 14 second P5 is on another Project (CRX)
There is a Boosted Protege LX running low 12's (Best one yet was 12.1)
Last edited by FUMacDaddySlomo; June-17th-2006 at 12:22 PM.
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