Sir Nuke

Let me guess....everyone is really surprised about how the vote is coming out right? DUH!! I mean this IS NOT A TOYOTA borad now is it! geeeez......

well its obvious to me that Toyota saw a good thing...THE P-5 and has tried their best to make some sort of knock off and grab a portion of the market......but that thing doesn't have near the class or sleek lines as the P-5. I think their commercial says it all....no one can even figure out what it it.....it certainly IS NOT a sleek machine......and escape pod maybe.....but not a hot car. :{D

douggie

Yesterday I went car shopping with my friend who's looking at the 2003 Toyota Corolla. So I picked him up in my P5 and drove to the Toyota dealership. The first thing I saw when I pulled in the dealer lot was the Matrix and it was parked at a customer parking area, so I pulled up right next to it

It was the souped up version, with nice big wheels, sports exhaust (pretty nice one) and the sports trim. But that thing is much bigger than our P5's and it's like 6-8 inches taller! So it's more like a mini mini-van than a wagon. I would say that when doing high speed cornering, our P5s would beat it hands down because we would have less body roll. I would also say that the Matrix is bigger and heavier and therefore it needs the extra power for good acceleration.

The front is the only part I liked about the Matrix. The side is kinda ugly because of the taller body and they try really hard to make a "flow" pattern with the door and windows to make the car seem not as tall as a mini-van.

The dealer noticed my car too and he said it looked nice

Needless to say yesterday's trip to the Toyota dealership didn't change a thing how I feel about my P5!

Oh BTW, the new corolla is nice, just like a mini camry. But I wouldn't buy one, coz there's no driving feeling at all and the shifter is really bad...

Sir Nuke

does anyone know what the Matrix weighs in at?

GNO

I was at the Chicago Auto Show yesterday. When I walked up to the Protege5 display I thought, "damn, that's small. . . is it lowered?" Two of them were stock and one was covered with stickers, momo seats and had a poorly positioned carbon fiber tailpipe. The Matrix on the other hand was big. Not quite as big as the Vibe, but close.

mazda2005

thats why i said the matrix was 'one of the ugliest' ever.

hi5

Well, I had some time to kill today so I went to my local toyota dealer. I was curious like everyone else how the Matrix stacks up to the P5. I even had my doubts like Kenji on whether I prefered the P5 or the matrix. Let me tell you, I made the right decision. First of all like the previous posts, the matrix is not a car! It is more like a lowered SUV. The damn this is huge! I mean it is more the size of a PT Cruiser, actually looks like a futuristic PT cruiser maybe. The inside however feels very like the size of our P5's. Since the cargo space is big in the back, they made the front to the back seats smaller. The one thing you will notice is that the car feels like it sit higher off the ground. Also the interiour is filled with Chrome pieces which to me look cheesy. I also played with the shifter and it feels akward to have your arm extended to shift. I prefer the regular spot on the floor. The doors are huge though and when you close it it feels much more like a SUV. To sum it up, the p5's should be considered a sports wagon, in the same class as a Subaru WRX wagon minus the power. The matrix is more of a lowered SUV, which puts it in a space which like the commercial says, "is it a space capsule". The problem I found with this car is even with the 180HP engine, the car is so much bigger than a celica, it will still be slow. Plus the sticker price with all the option pushes the prices around 22-23K which you might as well get a RAV4 or a Honda CRV. Overall, I like my car, and have no regrets, it is fun, sporty, economical, and has much more of a sport car feeling.



BTW I had doubts to on the Toyota Corroola S, but after checking out the inside interior and it is nasty! The white guages look horrible, and the side skirts looks too big! Damn, I thought Toyota was gonna imporve the interior! Is it me or am I too picky?

jcilforever

Looks like an Aztec corolla. The 180 hp model might be better looking but I saw a 1.8l and oh it is a Sport SUV

craigrrrp

the matrix is gonna be a fun car....has anyone driven a 2000 on celica gts.......the exact same engine...that car flies and if im not mistaken only a hundred or two hundred heavier...i used to sell toyotas and everyonce and a while i would take out the gts.... great upper end power......i love my slotege but im sorry after 80 mph there is no power ,you take that celica gts out and actually get on it definetly put a smile on my face sorry guys but to me there is not a comparison ...but then again im trading in my girlfriends accord for a matrix when it comes out.......wait isnt it out already see you later off to the toyota dealership

mnkyboy

Mini-vans! I think the Matrix looks like a mini-van. Depending on the options you pick, its more like a mini-van/suv. I think it looks pretty good, if you like big cars (suvs, van, etc). Even tho its big, the power doesnt measure up with the rest of the car. I to think it will be slow in normal driving. The guy who posted earlier about driving the celicas over 80mph, even tho the matrix may have the same engine, its not the same car! Look how small celicas are. Well, at least the soccer moms have a stylish car

sunbyrne

craigrrp: I'm sure the 180hp version of the Matrix has much better high-end power than the P5. With 50 extra HP, I don't doubt it for a moment. And yes, the P5 isn't all that great above 80mph. But I stand by my statement that the crappy torque curve makes the car gutless at low speed and rpm's--this is a not uncommon complaint from Celica owners. And frankly, I spend a lot more time going from 0-30 than I do from 80-90. The Matrix is probably faster overall than the P5, but I bet it doesn't feel that way until you're already at highway speed.

Oh, and according to Toyota's web site, the Matrix XRS is almost exactly 300 lbs. heavier than than the Celica GT-S, so you were a bit off but not too bad. I have also heard, but cannot substantiate, that the Matrix has a different tranny that is apparently not as well-matched to this particular engine as the Celica's tranny. Anyone else heard anything like this?

craigrrrp

SUNBYRN: first of all its a good thing they put a different tranny in the matrix when i was at the dealership i saw at least 1 celica gts come in a month because they would blow there engines because the gears are to close and at higher speeds they would miss gears(one of the salesman did this when i was in the car with him)btw$9000 to fix.....and i live in houston tx a very big city where everywhere you go is on the freeways so higher end power is important...another thing i also looked on toyota.com and actually the weight of the gts is 2580 the matrix is 2800...hmmmmm220 pounds heavier "so you were a little off but not to bad" .....now dont get me wrong i love my protege (if you would of read it closer i said my GIRLFRIEND IS GETTING THE CAR not me) and notice that i did not say anything about the lower end speed becaues im satisfied with it (for now) now i have not been able to see it in person yet ill let you know what i think about it on thursday

HubbMP5

I had a 2000 Celica GT for a year. Great car- lots of fun. But there were quality complaints- engine was VERY noisy at idle, hatch latch stopped working 2 days before I traded it, clunking from the suspension over speed bumps (took the dealer 3 tries to fix this), EXTREMELY easily chipped paint, etc... nothing major, really. But I was getting raped on my lease & when the P5 came out I realized just how overpriced the Celica was so I traded. The Matrix, IMO, was a mistake. Some people may like it- but I think the market is slowly trending away from SUV's and toward wagons. What they should've done was make a 5 door corolla with the "rally look" like the P5.

mnkyboy

I agree, I like the 3 door rally corolla. Hatchbacks are coming back, and they should have jumped on the bandwagon.

sunbyrne

craigrrp:

Hey, I live in the Houston area, too. I guess I just see too much traffic to spend a lot of time going 80+ mph. Actually, that's not quite true--I'm on 288 a lot and I could go 80+ there, but 288 is littered with speed traps and it's not worth it.

Now, on the weight, from Toyota.com:

Matrix XRS: 2800 lbs with stick, 2877 with automatic
Celica GT-S: 2500 lbs with stick, 2580 with automatic

Difference: 300 lbs with stick, 297 with automatic. You were comparing the automatic (heavier) Celica with the stick (lighter) Matrix. So saying the difference is 100-200 lbs is off by at least 50%, but hey, what's 100 lbs between friends?

And as TheMAN found it, it *is* the same tranny--bummer to hear that the Celica tranny isn't good, because that's what's on the Matrix. The problem I heard about is created by the larger wheels/tires, not the tranny.

I do accept that the Matrix is probably faster overall, and I admit I wouldn't mind a little more high-end oomph in my P5, but not at the cost of the low-end torque. Personal preference--I'm sure the Matrix is a fine vehicle overall, I just don't think it would suit me better than my P5.

SpaR/Ticus

I don't know if it's been said yet, but you cannot get the AWD with the six speed....or the GTS engine. BLAH! The car isn't worth crap AFAIC. I'm sure someone will do it aftermarket, but Toyota blew it with this one.