Man Cryogenically Freezes Engine - Gets 120 MPG
May-31st-2005, 09:47 PM
#1
Rotor Head
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Charlotte NC
Posts: 1,309
Man Cryogenically Freezes Engine - Gets 120 MPG
weird... i see no relation though...
http://www.kfor.com/Global/story.asp?s=3390503
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Americans guzzle 65 billion gallons of fuel a year and lately we have been paying a pretty penny at the pump. NewsChannel 4 has done reports in the past on how to get the most out of your gas. Now we introduce you to a new way to save on those gasoline dollars.
There is a man who fills up his tank once every two months. One tank of gas, literally, lasts him two months. He is freezing the price of gas by freezing something else.
People complain about the price of gas and we are all spending dearly to stay on the road these days. The money we spend on gas seems to burn up faster than the fuel.
While there may be little rhyme or reason to why the prices are on a perpetual roller-coaster, there is one man who has found a way to freeze them in their tracks, literally.
David Hutchison is a Cryogenics expert. He built this Cryo-Process himself. He runs a business out of his garage where he cryogenically tempers all kinds of metals. He submerges them in a frozen tank of nitrogen vapor that is 300 degrees below zero.
David says, “During that time, at minus 300 degrees, the molecules slow down. Then they reorganize themselves. That's when the actual chemical change happens.”
Hutchison cryogenically tempers machine parts, tools, golf clubs and even razors. He says it makes them last three to five times longer.
A few years ago he began an experiment on his hybrid Honda, freezing the engine components. The results were a fuel-efficiency dream.
David Hutchison says, “You should expect a “Cryo'd” engine to last anywhere from 600,000 to 1 million miles without wearing out.”
A hybrid Honda typically gets really great gas mileage anyway, around 50 miles to the gallon, but David Hutchison's cryogenically tempered engine has been known to get close to 120 miles a gallon.
“It's just a very efficient vehicle.” Hutchison says,
Racers have picked up on David's trick of cryogenically freezing car parts. It is now widely accepted among NASCAR and Indy-car racers.
Hutchison has no plans of taking his Honda to the track. His prize is in his pocketbook.
David says, “I thought about selling it, but gas prices keep going up. So, I thought, I'm not going to sell it.”
Hutchison tells us cryogenically tempering car parts has more benefits than just fuel efficiency. He freezes all of the brake rotors at a car dealership near his home in Missouri. It makes them last three to five times longer.
http://www.kfor.com/Global/story.asp?s=3390503
---------------------------
Americans guzzle 65 billion gallons of fuel a year and lately we have been paying a pretty penny at the pump. NewsChannel 4 has done reports in the past on how to get the most out of your gas. Now we introduce you to a new way to save on those gasoline dollars.
There is a man who fills up his tank once every two months. One tank of gas, literally, lasts him two months. He is freezing the price of gas by freezing something else.
People complain about the price of gas and we are all spending dearly to stay on the road these days. The money we spend on gas seems to burn up faster than the fuel.
While there may be little rhyme or reason to why the prices are on a perpetual roller-coaster, there is one man who has found a way to freeze them in their tracks, literally.
David Hutchison is a Cryogenics expert. He built this Cryo-Process himself. He runs a business out of his garage where he cryogenically tempers all kinds of metals. He submerges them in a frozen tank of nitrogen vapor that is 300 degrees below zero.
David says, “During that time, at minus 300 degrees, the molecules slow down. Then they reorganize themselves. That's when the actual chemical change happens.”
Hutchison cryogenically tempers machine parts, tools, golf clubs and even razors. He says it makes them last three to five times longer.
A few years ago he began an experiment on his hybrid Honda, freezing the engine components. The results were a fuel-efficiency dream.
David Hutchison says, “You should expect a “Cryo'd” engine to last anywhere from 600,000 to 1 million miles without wearing out.”
A hybrid Honda typically gets really great gas mileage anyway, around 50 miles to the gallon, but David Hutchison's cryogenically tempered engine has been known to get close to 120 miles a gallon.
“It's just a very efficient vehicle.” Hutchison says,
Racers have picked up on David's trick of cryogenically freezing car parts. It is now widely accepted among NASCAR and Indy-car racers.
Hutchison has no plans of taking his Honda to the track. His prize is in his pocketbook.
David says, “I thought about selling it, but gas prices keep going up. So, I thought, I'm not going to sell it.”
Hutchison tells us cryogenically tempering car parts has more benefits than just fuel efficiency. He freezes all of the brake rotors at a car dealership near his home in Missouri. It makes them last three to five times longer.
June-1st-2005, 10:28 AM
#5
The man behind the mask
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 11,572
sheesh, if I could get 50mpg out of my car with a blower I'd be super happy.
i've been shopping around for a nice scooter....150cc + 80mpg + 65mph + $1999 = fun little fuel-friendly toy.
i've been shopping around for a nice scooter....150cc + 80mpg + 65mph + $1999 = fun little fuel-friendly toy.
June-1st-2005, 07:34 PM
#6
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Alabama
Posts: 238
so, what parts does he exactly freezes? and does he just installes them back and then has to refreeze all the parts at certain time periouds? or is it just one time freeze and have ultimate gas milage? Im asking because i have access to liquid nitrogen.....
June-1st-2005, 09:35 PM
#9
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Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,164
...yeah, like some guy is able to make a 120mpg engine in his garage by freezing the parts and putting it together again, and yet the mightiest engineering facilities in the world (i.e. Toyota, General Motors, et all) have not been able to offer us anything better than 50mpg in cars like the low tech Metro (economy car) or the high tech Prius (hybrid). Bullshit, folks. Don't believe everything that you read. I happen to know a thing or two about metallurgy, and this is not a proven method of hardening metals. To change grain structure, you can (in laymans terms):
1) Diffuse another element into the surface, or case harden by creating a thin oxidative film
2) Heat to red hot, then cool rapidly to get a tight, small grain structure (heat treat & quench)
3) Cold work (i.e. form the metal when it is not red hot to influence grain orientation). An example would be forging.
4) Alloy the base metal with other elements before forming
...there are other methods, which I have forgotten. But remember that a running engine does not have a great deal of friction. Most friction (and wear) occurs during startup. Also, modern engines have tight tolerances, excellent materials, fantasticly fine surface finishes on bearing surfaces and sliding areas (ie cylinder walls). These parts are highly durable as-is under normal circumstances, seal well, and slide with ease where necessary. With nearly any new car there should be no durability concerns with base engine components well past 100K. Therefore, even if it were possible to improve the strength of base engine parts in your very own garage, you will see no fuel economy benefit just from doing so.
1) Diffuse another element into the surface, or case harden by creating a thin oxidative film
2) Heat to red hot, then cool rapidly to get a tight, small grain structure (heat treat & quench)
3) Cold work (i.e. form the metal when it is not red hot to influence grain orientation). An example would be forging.
4) Alloy the base metal with other elements before forming
...there are other methods, which I have forgotten. But remember that a running engine does not have a great deal of friction. Most friction (and wear) occurs during startup. Also, modern engines have tight tolerances, excellent materials, fantasticly fine surface finishes on bearing surfaces and sliding areas (ie cylinder walls). These parts are highly durable as-is under normal circumstances, seal well, and slide with ease where necessary. With nearly any new car there should be no durability concerns with base engine components well past 100K. Therefore, even if it were possible to improve the strength of base engine parts in your very own garage, you will see no fuel economy benefit just from doing so.
June-1st-2005, 11:00 PM
#10
The man behind the mask
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 11,572
I agree with ya Juddz, however friction is the sole enemy of reliability/durability and mileage/power. With more durable parts tighter tolerances can be allowed boosting performance or mileage...but neither both at once.
Removing friction is easy but creating a complete seal is not. If you're able to reduce friction and seal better more power is transfered.
I doubt the numbers claims but do NOT doubt that people have and will continue to make 100+mpg cars. My father is a chemist and told me of several people he had actually met who in the late 60's developed engines that would travel at 100mph and get almost 200mpg. (not at the same time). These plans were either bought by the big oil companies or the creators were murdered. My dad even gave me the names of two specific people....I'll find out who they were and link you some info about their designs.
Big Oil does NOT want a more efficient engine. They only want to appease the bare minimums set forth by the government.....the government doesn't profit saving the environment...they only do the bare minimum THEY can get by with to appease the enviromentalists.
When the government is run by Big Oil gas prices will staty high....Had you bitches voted differently we'd have cars running on ketchup right now!
Removing friction is easy but creating a complete seal is not. If you're able to reduce friction and seal better more power is transfered.
I doubt the numbers claims but do NOT doubt that people have and will continue to make 100+mpg cars. My father is a chemist and told me of several people he had actually met who in the late 60's developed engines that would travel at 100mph and get almost 200mpg. (not at the same time). These plans were either bought by the big oil companies or the creators were murdered. My dad even gave me the names of two specific people....I'll find out who they were and link you some info about their designs.
Big Oil does NOT want a more efficient engine. They only want to appease the bare minimums set forth by the government.....the government doesn't profit saving the environment...they only do the bare minimum THEY can get by with to appease the enviromentalists.
When the government is run by Big Oil gas prices will staty high....Had you bitches voted differently we'd have cars running on ketchup right now!
June-1st-2005, 11:42 PM
#11
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Alabama
Posts: 238
hey, this is slightly off the topic... i saw on discovery channel that theres a synthetic diesel which is derived from soybeans, yes you have read right, soybean and i think some sort of conventional acid, however the process price come slightly just below the price of regular diesel. So maybe it wont be ketchup that will fuel our future cars but soybean oil diesel....
June-2nd-2005, 09:58 AM
#12
The man behind the mask
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 11,572
UCLA students (in an effort to fight high gas prices) came up with a way to make a cars engine run on hazelnut oil. Wow, there's great news. A gallon of gas for $2 or a gallon of Hazelnut oil for $38. Way to go California students!!
June-2nd-2005, 11:25 AM
#13
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Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,164
...the American consumer does want fuel efficient cars, even if they have to pay significantly more for them. There is a 2-month wait for the Toyota Prius, and similar waits for other hybrids. They sell at sticker or above. And, nobody seems to connect the following dots:
- Compared with other cars on the market, hybrids are at best competent in terms of performance, handling, etc. The only thing they excel at is fuel economy.
- Hybrids cost a lot more than an economy car or SUV offering similar comfort and performance (but less fuel economy)
- Hybrids are an expensive way to save on cheap fuel. Even if gas were to climb to $2.50 a gallon, it would take a hybrid that gets 50mpg over 50,000 miles of use to break even with a comparable economy car that gets 30mpg and stickers for $4000 less.
- Durability of hybrid drive components (including electrical infrastructure) are unproven
- Hybrid economy drops in the cold season
- Magazines are often unable to duplicate EPA mileage claims
- Modern diesels offer equivalent performance to gasoline engines, and offer substantially better fuel economy. And yet, there is no stampede to the dealerships demanding diesels
All of the above supports my theory that hybrids are purchased as a "green" status symbol, an interesting bauble, a statement of political correctness, or for any other reason besides real-world practicality and economy. High fuel efficiency technology (in and of itself) is highly marketable, and automakers now know this. If it was possible to make a 120mpg car and put it into production, the company with the know-how would have a huge advantage in the market (even if it cost more). Therefore, I strongly believe that there is no conspiracy to hide such technology.
- Compared with other cars on the market, hybrids are at best competent in terms of performance, handling, etc. The only thing they excel at is fuel economy.
- Hybrids cost a lot more than an economy car or SUV offering similar comfort and performance (but less fuel economy)
- Hybrids are an expensive way to save on cheap fuel. Even if gas were to climb to $2.50 a gallon, it would take a hybrid that gets 50mpg over 50,000 miles of use to break even with a comparable economy car that gets 30mpg and stickers for $4000 less.
- Durability of hybrid drive components (including electrical infrastructure) are unproven
- Hybrid economy drops in the cold season
- Magazines are often unable to duplicate EPA mileage claims
- Modern diesels offer equivalent performance to gasoline engines, and offer substantially better fuel economy. And yet, there is no stampede to the dealerships demanding diesels
All of the above supports my theory that hybrids are purchased as a "green" status symbol, an interesting bauble, a statement of political correctness, or for any other reason besides real-world practicality and economy. High fuel efficiency technology (in and of itself) is highly marketable, and automakers now know this. If it was possible to make a 120mpg car and put it into production, the company with the know-how would have a huge advantage in the market (even if it cost more). Therefore, I strongly believe that there is no conspiracy to hide such technology.
June-2nd-2005, 11:32 AM
#14
The man behind the mask
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 11,572
very interesting write up.... I fully agree as well.
Desiel with a nice turbo for me please. I read Automobile magazine where they compared the VW TDi with the Prius and the Tdi got 38mpg in the city and 58mpg on the highway...the prius by comparison got something like 40mpg city and 32mpg highway. Do you think toyota boasts its highway mileage?? hells naw.
p.s. Turbo desiels are great as commuters and racers. Simple exhaust mods and an adjustable chip or ecu and you've got a split personality. You guys remember those videos of the 3ton 4X4 trucks running 11s quartermiles on desiel?? same premise without the extra 2tons.
Desiel with a nice turbo for me please. I read Automobile magazine where they compared the VW TDi with the Prius and the Tdi got 38mpg in the city and 58mpg on the highway...the prius by comparison got something like 40mpg city and 32mpg highway. Do you think toyota boasts its highway mileage?? hells naw.
p.s. Turbo desiels are great as commuters and racers. Simple exhaust mods and an adjustable chip or ecu and you've got a split personality. You guys remember those videos of the 3ton 4X4 trucks running 11s quartermiles on desiel?? same premise without the extra 2tons.
June-2nd-2005, 11:45 AM
#15
Awesome Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 3,186
juddz, you are absolutely correct, IMO.
One comment on the diesels. I believe a lot of Americans, unlike our European comrades, can't get past associating diesels with noisy, smelly, dirty old trucks and buses (or old Rabbit diesels, lol). That, and diesel fuel is not always readily available at your local Sunoco, &tc.
It's kind of a catch-22 situation: people don't buy diesels because they fear running out of fuel and gas stations don't carry it because there aren't enough diesels to justify an extra pump.
One comment on the diesels. I believe a lot of Americans, unlike our European comrades, can't get past associating diesels with noisy, smelly, dirty old trucks and buses (or old Rabbit diesels, lol). That, and diesel fuel is not always readily available at your local Sunoco, &tc.
It's kind of a catch-22 situation: people don't buy diesels because they fear running out of fuel and gas stations don't carry it because there aren't enough diesels to justify an extra pump.