Upgrading My Sound System
April-24th-2004, 07:14 PM
#1
Protege Newbie
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 8
Upgrading My Sound System
I have a 2003 LX and I am looking at upgrading and adding a sub. Now I really like how the MazdaSpeed Proteges have the sub built in and doesn't really take up a lot of room. Would it be possible to buy the parts for it individually (the box and the stuff to mount it) and then buy my own sub and amp seperate and put them in the enclosure? This is an idea I have been thinking about for a little while and wanted to see other people's opinions. I am trying to save space so that I can actually use my trunk instead of having a massive box sliding around 
Last edited by Padawan; April-26th-2004 at 08:23 PM.
April-26th-2004, 01:48 PM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario, CANADA
Posts: 70
I have a 2 piece box from MTX. Each box is a 8" sub with a horn and built in crossovers. Its very skinny, and because its two seperate boxes, you can move it around the hatch/trunk, even stick them on the back seat or floor, or just take it out.
April-30th-2004, 03:17 AM
#3
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 160
eek... so MTX truck boxes??? good for outdoor parites I guess. bad for your car...
THis IS indeed apretty good idea, nad you might wnat to hitup some MSP owners to see if they're selling their factory boxes. (It's not too uncommon) try http://www.protege5.com, lots more activity.
The othe roption depending ont he state of your freetime/handiness, etc is to build youw own fiberglass box. I'd anever thought I was capable of doing so, but somehow I now have. VERY cool, and you cna mold them to fit in whatever nook and cranny you've got. http://protege5.com/vbb225/showthrea...&goto=lastpost
Or of course there's endless possibilities for getting creative and building a complex wood box that'll tuck in neatly as well. MSP's have 8" subs, you might want ot look for atleast a 10. But there's no need to go for more than one or evne a 15, that stuff's either just silly or for show. you can get downright deafening with a single 10 or 12 in the right application.
THis IS indeed apretty good idea, nad you might wnat to hitup some MSP owners to see if they're selling their factory boxes. (It's not too uncommon) try http://www.protege5.com, lots more activity.
The othe roption depending ont he state of your freetime/handiness, etc is to build youw own fiberglass box. I'd anever thought I was capable of doing so, but somehow I now have. VERY cool, and you cna mold them to fit in whatever nook and cranny you've got. http://protege5.com/vbb225/showthrea...&goto=lastpost
Or of course there's endless possibilities for getting creative and building a complex wood box that'll tuck in neatly as well. MSP's have 8" subs, you might want ot look for atleast a 10. But there's no need to go for more than one or evne a 15, that stuff's either just silly or for show. you can get downright deafening with a single 10 or 12 in the right application.
April-30th-2004, 07:58 AM
#5
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario, CANADA
Posts: 70
Seems like a great way to get the sound without loosing any trunk space, almost none at all.
I'm at Home Depot all the time, so this setup is great.
I've had it in the Shadow and now my P5. Sounds great.
I'm at Home Depot all the time, so this setup is great.
I've had it in the Shadow and now my P5. Sounds great.
April-30th-2004, 02:18 PM
#6
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 160
me too, need my hatch space, but also I LOVE my quality boomboom, that's why I made mine. Consequently most of my materials for this project were obtained At Home Depot.
http://www.protegeclub.com/forum/att...&postid=294559
http://www.protegeclub.com/forum/att...&postid=294559
May-7th-2004, 02:01 AM
#8
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 160
Nicely presented and such, but i still think that 6x9 on the faux-rear-deck bit is about the silliest thing ever. 'Course I'm not exactly sure how that's saving space either, those amps would be nicely gouged and nasty with any of my usual useage. Not to mention those subs are begging for things to be piled on top of them, but if you just chimed in 'cause you wanna show-off and bling bling with little regaurd for sound Quality... *cheers*
Last edited by Poseur; May-7th-2004 at 02:05 AM.
May-7th-2004, 07:33 PM
#9
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Indiana
Posts: 89
Little regard for sound quality? Well lets see the dimensions of the boxes were calculated with a CAD program, as have the enclosers in the doors for the mids, the "faux rear deck" has been replaced a while ago (it was a temporary thing) with an eclosed rear top mount design, and I will bet you any amount of money my stereo sounds cleaner and louder than yours or anybody you know. And not crappy BOOM bass either. This is not my first stereo install. Ive had a BMW, a 76 VW beetle, an S4, and my 86 323 GT all done up with custom installs. Ive done fiberglass enclosers for many (10+) people, including complete systems.
As far as amps getting scratched up, I keep a black towel rolled up in the jack area. But I rarely if ever have carrried anything back there. I have an "02 4Runner for that.
I wasnt trying to brag, but to do the point at which these forums are for. To give an idea of what others have done. So when you "Do" anything even close to what I've done and will do, keep your comments to yourself.
As far as amps getting scratched up, I keep a black towel rolled up in the jack area. But I rarely if ever have carrried anything back there. I have an "02 4Runner for that.
I wasnt trying to brag, but to do the point at which these forums are for. To give an idea of what others have done. So when you "Do" anything even close to what I've done and will do, keep your comments to yourself.
Last edited by TRBOMP5; May-7th-2004 at 07:36 PM.
May-8th-2004, 02:52 AM
#11
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 160
I'm not really tryingto sparkup a battle, perhaps someone else, maybe a SQ competitor,or, really anyone who's clued in to true quality car audio will chime in here as well. The biggest issue you've got is the extranious rear speakers... I emplore you to find ANY SQ car that runs even ONE set of full range speakers in the rear, let alone 2. IF they run any at all, it's generally simply midrange and often underpowered alot. simply to provide "fill" The true key is to throw alot of clean power to a nice set of speakers up front. Preferably positioned and aimed properly... From what I can tell you're running a pair of 6" components in your front doors, 5's in the rear doors, and a set of 6x9's in the rear deck. I'm gonna assume that youre doors are run off of your 80x4 amp and the 6x9's are getting the bigger 2ch amp. This would put 90w to each of the 6x9's firing into the ceiling, and passively at the back of your head. with 40w in the rear doors which if installed right, MIGHT sound alright to rear seaters, if they weren't busy being deafened by the raquet behind their head. and then 40w upfront to somehopefully thoughtfully placed 6's that would likely sound pretty good by themselves. All of the parts are atleast decent stuff mindyou. I was never the HUGEST fan of polk, but I can't say the EX line was entirely offensive. Nowthen if you spent about a year tuning and tweaking them with the proper electronics (which NONE of us could afford) working with timedelays, etc. MAYBE you could make it sound non-offensive to a true audiophile, but I'm gonna go ahead and say that's pretty unlikely... Also, your deck is NOT a very SQ oriented unit. Medeocre at best, but a 94db s/n ratio??? *L* That can't sound good once you put some power behind it. I'll bet it looks pretty spiffy though.
As far as sealed enclosures for your mids, you ARE aware that mids (including yours) are just about all designed for IB applications, right? meaning that if you simply sealed off your door properly, you'd be MUCH better off than enclosing them in a tight space where lower notes are gonna create pressure that the higher midrange notes will have to fight against... as far as the 6x9's go... Seal them all you want, or whatever... Those are the type of things that belong in little wedge boxes in the back windows of transmarostangs where you need the extra noise to force it's way through the mullett of the driver. It's not that they're bad peakers, it's just that I've yet to see an appication that TRUELY called for them.
Truth be told, I showed your pic to a member of a car audio board I frequent and he got a good chuckle out of it. Which, if you were to post up about your setup ANYWHERE where ppl knew stuff would prettymuch be the across-the-board responce.
I'd gladly accept your challange on the SQ comparison. if it were in any way possible. Even right now with my drop-in Krappa's that I don't really like the sound of, but I'm the only one I've ever known who's thought this. They're getting over 200w RMS each which keeps them NICELY controlled. Not to mention thet they're up front where the real music should be. How many concerts do you go to where instead of facing the band, you turn around and stare at the door???
I am, however not contending that my car is anything spectacular... All of my friends from podunk around here are blown away by it, namely because noone around here knows any better. they all slap big 6x9's in the back, and amplifly the hell out of those, add a bandpass box and call it awesome. There's plenty of cars out there that sound much better than mine. I'm not even really the type to say "mine's cooler than yours" IN fact I generalyl never even discuss my stereo with anyone unless they're a true enthusiast. However, since you brought it up, I would say that hands down, my car would sound better than your well-intended but painfully over-equpped setup.
Might be news, but with a sealed box, enclosure dimensions can vary quite a bit and sound just about the same. Within a certain margin of error, The biggest difference it makes is in power handling. And besides, woofer displacement throws it all off anyway. Do you know howmuch exactly those subs displace? I've played with cad plenty, doesn't impress me much. My box isn't cad-designed in any way shape or form, it was all guesstimated with styrofoam peanuts, but certified with water, and I'm within .02cubic feet of optimal after woofer displacement is thrown in. (this much variance is likely existant in even the best-built boxes between the design/construction process. it's just how it goes, I just happened ot hit it by sheer dumb luck) Doesn't even matter, though I could've been off by .2 feet and been fine. Cad-design and then sucessfully build a unique 6th order bandpass or something like some of the other members on here do, and that may impress me.
If you really wanna throw down, I've overall spent about a grand and I'm pushing 1540watts... Not toomuch$ for something that WILL hurt you. Or just as happily taken down a couple few notches, play some of the cleanest music possible for the$... You would be running under 1kw with three times the speakers I have. The majority of which are under-powered, and in the wrong places. The other side-effect of multiple speakers is it wastes money REAL fast. Nowthen, this is just an assumption, but short of any "cheats" like homie hookups, etc, I'm prety sure you spent more for your goods than I did mine.
In the sub dept. you MIGHT be able to get as loud with your 2 12's as my single tucked-away setup, but it's a eD 12a that's pushing 1100w. Short of having some nicely built ported boxes It's prettymuch not gonna happen with half the power (ask anyone who's heared one) I'm not a basshead, but it's there should I decide to call upon it... I out-hit dual 12's all the time. Maybe not the loudest you can get for the power I push, but definately about the cleanest sounding. AND that power and such makes for a nice tidy install that leaves me room for real world wagon duty.
I'm not doubting your install ability. looks like you can do it decently, and somewhat cleanly, it's just a bit toomuch towards excess to really be serious about SQ. Toomany ppl forgo the simplicity of having a very clean accurate front soundstage for the appeal of "more is better" Can't blame you it's the american way. I'm TRUELY just trying to help everyone out here. there's more to cleanly reproduced music than Just adding speakers. If you doubt me, go to a SQ competition.
I really hate to whip this all out on you since it's obvious you DID put alot of time into your car, and it DOES look pretty good, it's just that it's mis-guided at best, and I don't want others getting any bad ideas. If you wish to try to salvage some SQ out of it all, I'd put that big amp on the front speakers, and possibly, maybe run that 4ch to your excess of rears, only turned down ALOT. And I mean like so that it's putting out maybe 10watts per channel at most. And overall, be careful on the style-biting. Ryder's JBL amp-install is setup MUCH cleaner than that.
In the words of Austin Powers' fasha.... "this ain't my first rodeo, cowboy" I too have plenty of installs under my belt.
As far as sealed enclosures for your mids, you ARE aware that mids (including yours) are just about all designed for IB applications, right? meaning that if you simply sealed off your door properly, you'd be MUCH better off than enclosing them in a tight space where lower notes are gonna create pressure that the higher midrange notes will have to fight against... as far as the 6x9's go... Seal them all you want, or whatever... Those are the type of things that belong in little wedge boxes in the back windows of transmarostangs where you need the extra noise to force it's way through the mullett of the driver. It's not that they're bad peakers, it's just that I've yet to see an appication that TRUELY called for them.
Truth be told, I showed your pic to a member of a car audio board I frequent and he got a good chuckle out of it. Which, if you were to post up about your setup ANYWHERE where ppl knew stuff would prettymuch be the across-the-board responce.
I'd gladly accept your challange on the SQ comparison. if it were in any way possible. Even right now with my drop-in Krappa's that I don't really like the sound of, but I'm the only one I've ever known who's thought this. They're getting over 200w RMS each which keeps them NICELY controlled. Not to mention thet they're up front where the real music should be. How many concerts do you go to where instead of facing the band, you turn around and stare at the door???
I am, however not contending that my car is anything spectacular... All of my friends from podunk around here are blown away by it, namely because noone around here knows any better. they all slap big 6x9's in the back, and amplifly the hell out of those, add a bandpass box and call it awesome. There's plenty of cars out there that sound much better than mine. I'm not even really the type to say "mine's cooler than yours" IN fact I generalyl never even discuss my stereo with anyone unless they're a true enthusiast. However, since you brought it up, I would say that hands down, my car would sound better than your well-intended but painfully over-equpped setup.
Might be news, but with a sealed box, enclosure dimensions can vary quite a bit and sound just about the same. Within a certain margin of error, The biggest difference it makes is in power handling. And besides, woofer displacement throws it all off anyway. Do you know howmuch exactly those subs displace? I've played with cad plenty, doesn't impress me much. My box isn't cad-designed in any way shape or form, it was all guesstimated with styrofoam peanuts, but certified with water, and I'm within .02cubic feet of optimal after woofer displacement is thrown in. (this much variance is likely existant in even the best-built boxes between the design/construction process. it's just how it goes, I just happened ot hit it by sheer dumb luck) Doesn't even matter, though I could've been off by .2 feet and been fine. Cad-design and then sucessfully build a unique 6th order bandpass or something like some of the other members on here do, and that may impress me.
If you really wanna throw down, I've overall spent about a grand and I'm pushing 1540watts... Not toomuch$ for something that WILL hurt you. Or just as happily taken down a couple few notches, play some of the cleanest music possible for the$... You would be running under 1kw with three times the speakers I have. The majority of which are under-powered, and in the wrong places. The other side-effect of multiple speakers is it wastes money REAL fast. Nowthen, this is just an assumption, but short of any "cheats" like homie hookups, etc, I'm prety sure you spent more for your goods than I did mine.
In the sub dept. you MIGHT be able to get as loud with your 2 12's as my single tucked-away setup, but it's a eD 12a that's pushing 1100w. Short of having some nicely built ported boxes It's prettymuch not gonna happen with half the power (ask anyone who's heared one) I'm not a basshead, but it's there should I decide to call upon it... I out-hit dual 12's all the time. Maybe not the loudest you can get for the power I push, but definately about the cleanest sounding. AND that power and such makes for a nice tidy install that leaves me room for real world wagon duty.
I'm not doubting your install ability. looks like you can do it decently, and somewhat cleanly, it's just a bit toomuch towards excess to really be serious about SQ. Toomany ppl forgo the simplicity of having a very clean accurate front soundstage for the appeal of "more is better" Can't blame you it's the american way. I'm TRUELY just trying to help everyone out here. there's more to cleanly reproduced music than Just adding speakers. If you doubt me, go to a SQ competition.
I really hate to whip this all out on you since it's obvious you DID put alot of time into your car, and it DOES look pretty good, it's just that it's mis-guided at best, and I don't want others getting any bad ideas. If you wish to try to salvage some SQ out of it all, I'd put that big amp on the front speakers, and possibly, maybe run that 4ch to your excess of rears, only turned down ALOT. And I mean like so that it's putting out maybe 10watts per channel at most. And overall, be careful on the style-biting. Ryder's JBL amp-install is setup MUCH cleaner than that.
In the words of Austin Powers' fasha.... "this ain't my first rodeo, cowboy" I too have plenty of installs under my belt.
Last edited by Poseur; May-8th-2004 at 04:52 AM.
May-8th-2004, 03:16 AM
#12
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 160
My apologies to everyone for the threadjack, Just trying to be informative so we don't all make the same mistakes. It just frustrates me, this place is getting kinda ghetto. Prettysoon everyone'll be chiming in telling you to get Audiobahn everything....
Back to the initial topic... CHeck out these pages as well as my previously posted thread.
http://www.e-kittan.com/fibre.html
http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/main/
My box is currently un-finished, but you can see the basic shape, and the space-savings over my previous edition of a box...
http://protege5.com/vbb225/attachmen...chmentid=16251
I garantee you that if you had a bit of time to spent fiberglassing, you could tuck a 10 in soo tightly and cleanly that you'd never notice it was there when you were carrying thigns around. except for how nice your car sounds. Thatsaid, yep the MSP boxes will work alright. if you're looking for "just a bit" more. Thatsaid, the vast majority of MSPers sell their boxes off because they generally upgrade to a 10 or 12.
Back to the initial topic... CHeck out these pages as well as my previously posted thread.
http://www.e-kittan.com/fibre.html
http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/main/
My box is currently un-finished, but you can see the basic shape, and the space-savings over my previous edition of a box...
http://protege5.com/vbb225/attachmen...chmentid=16251
I garantee you that if you had a bit of time to spent fiberglassing, you could tuck a 10 in soo tightly and cleanly that you'd never notice it was there when you were carrying thigns around. except for how nice your car sounds. Thatsaid, yep the MSP boxes will work alright. if you're looking for "just a bit" more. Thatsaid, the vast majority of MSPers sell their boxes off because they generally upgrade to a 10 or 12.
Last edited by Poseur; May-8th-2004 at 03:22 AM.
May-8th-2004, 10:02 AM
#13
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Indiana
Posts: 89
I did not mean to get snappy. It just seemed you assumed I didnt know what I was doing right off the bat. You were close on the amps. cept the 90 is going to the fronts and the 80x4 is going to the backs. And the 6x9's are turned down quite a bit. I also did not want an entire front soundstage as the majority of the time my kids are with me so I have it adjusted more in the center. Another thing, my stereo was dialed in by someone with more electronics and money than we have. I used to do installs for a place called Lehman electronics for about 4 yrs. I still know some guys there and they dialed it all in for me. And yes the Head is the weakest part of the system. I used to also have a really nice Clarion but about 9 mos ago I left my car outside as we were having a garage sale, and mine and my wifes cars were broken into. Both our stereos were stolen. This was just a quick buy that has not been upgraded yet. (the turbo has put the stereo on hold) O and i have hardly anything in the stereo system. All components are new, all wiring is monster cable, and I have about $1500 in it total. (Got a lot of it from a place when they closed) And online from a place called IKE Sound. So I dont think its all that bad for only a piddly $1500.
OK enough of the pissing match. And I do thank you for your input. Guys just get to confrontational too easily, and i apologize.
OK enough of the pissing match. And I do thank you for your input. Guys just get to confrontational too easily, and i apologize.
May-8th-2004, 12:17 PM
#14
Protege Enthusiast
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: west coast cali
Posts: 63
hmmmmmmm.
why dont you take your car.. and get a reading on a db meter.. THEN.. ill take my car and get it read on a db meter.. AND.. well post the numbers.. i dont even come to this board.. BUT.. poseur is my frient.. and well.. he knows his ****.. and obviously u dont... so i have the same amp set up.. and a sigle 12. -=P and im willing to bet cash money id run your **** in a db drag....
Lemme kno
Lemme kno
May-8th-2004, 01:09 PM
#15
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Gainesville, FL
Posts: 398
Hey fizzle, since you "don't come to this board", and you don't have anything constructive to say, how about just staying quiet? TRBO and Poseur seem to have worked out there differences and everything's cool, let's leave it at that. Also, if you read TRBO's last post, you'd see that his setup is a bit better than Poseur initially thought, and Poseur seems to be able to handle himself anyway. No need for the everybody to start callin' in their boyz....