Audio noob
January-26th-2003, 01:56 AM
#1
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ohio
Posts: 426
Audio noob
First off I am not a total noob to car audio. I have installed 3 head units before, but that is all. This time I am thinking about adding a 4-channel amp and new speakers. I am not looking to have a killer system. Stock, I think the car sounds alright but when I turn it up it starts sounding bad. I also am not looking at spending a ton of cash. Also, I will be doing the install myself.
I have a lot of questions.
Through the research that I have done I think I am going to get an Alpine V-Power 4 channel amp. I have read a lot of good things about it here and crutchfield is selling them for $150 or $127 from their scratch and dent store. I like saving money so I was thinking of getting it from their scratch and dent store. Its still new, they tested it to make sure it works, and it comes with a warrenty from crutchfield. Do you think getting one that is not cosmetically perfect is a good idea or no?
I still haven't decided on where to mount the amp. Under the seat sounds great except I don't want to have to remove the heat vent under there. In the trunk on the back of the seat doesn't sound that bad either, but if I fold the seats down to carry something large I'm afraid that it could get damaged. However, this is probably where I will be mounting it.
I want to clear up how I hook up the amp. This is what I am thinking. Correct me if I am wrong. Run a power wire to the amp from the battery. Run a ground from the amp to a metal part of the car that is nearby. Then do I run a remote turn on for the amp and what do I hook that up to? For speakers I can get an adapter that will plug into the back of the HU and run speaker wires from there to the amp. Then run speaker wires from the amp back to where the stock speaker harness is and plug it into there. And I run the speaker wires on the passenger side of the car and the power wires on the drivers side. Does that sound right?
I haven't decided on speakers yet. I think I might just get some 6.5 components for the front for now and upgrade the rears a litte bit later. That way my wallet doesn't take a big hit all at once. (Maybe I can even get them for my birthday) What are some good brands to look at and what are the brands to stay away from? Also, where is a good place to mount the tweeters and the little boxes(cross-overs?) that come with them? And they get wired to the front speakers or the where?
Last question. I read in a post by blueLEDS that if I don't have over 50 watts RMS going to the speakers that the stock speaker wires should be fine. The Alpine amp I chose is 40 watts RMS so I should be ok right?
I lied. What is a good wireing kit for the amp? Does a kit come with all the wires I will need? Should I run an extra ground from the battery to the chassis?
Sorry for the long post but I want to make sure that I understand what is involved and that I am not going to make any mistakes. I think I will quit now so that its not so long people will not read it, but it may already be too late. Thanks for your help and thanks for reading my long post.
I have a lot of questions.
Through the research that I have done I think I am going to get an Alpine V-Power 4 channel amp. I have read a lot of good things about it here and crutchfield is selling them for $150 or $127 from their scratch and dent store. I like saving money so I was thinking of getting it from their scratch and dent store. Its still new, they tested it to make sure it works, and it comes with a warrenty from crutchfield. Do you think getting one that is not cosmetically perfect is a good idea or no?
I still haven't decided on where to mount the amp. Under the seat sounds great except I don't want to have to remove the heat vent under there. In the trunk on the back of the seat doesn't sound that bad either, but if I fold the seats down to carry something large I'm afraid that it could get damaged. However, this is probably where I will be mounting it.
I want to clear up how I hook up the amp. This is what I am thinking. Correct me if I am wrong. Run a power wire to the amp from the battery. Run a ground from the amp to a metal part of the car that is nearby. Then do I run a remote turn on for the amp and what do I hook that up to? For speakers I can get an adapter that will plug into the back of the HU and run speaker wires from there to the amp. Then run speaker wires from the amp back to where the stock speaker harness is and plug it into there. And I run the speaker wires on the passenger side of the car and the power wires on the drivers side. Does that sound right?
I haven't decided on speakers yet. I think I might just get some 6.5 components for the front for now and upgrade the rears a litte bit later. That way my wallet doesn't take a big hit all at once. (Maybe I can even get them for my birthday) What are some good brands to look at and what are the brands to stay away from? Also, where is a good place to mount the tweeters and the little boxes(cross-overs?) that come with them? And they get wired to the front speakers or the where?
Last question. I read in a post by blueLEDS that if I don't have over 50 watts RMS going to the speakers that the stock speaker wires should be fine. The Alpine amp I chose is 40 watts RMS so I should be ok right?
I lied. What is a good wireing kit for the amp? Does a kit come with all the wires I will need? Should I run an extra ground from the battery to the chassis?
Sorry for the long post but I want to make sure that I understand what is involved and that I am not going to make any mistakes. I think I will quit now so that its not so long people will not read it, but it may already be too late. Thanks for your help and thanks for reading my long post.
January-26th-2003, 03:47 AM
#2
formerly chastan
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 2,350
Many questions!!! Just some "almost-answers" from me 
The remote turn on hooks into a blue/white wire on the back of the radio, at least on aftermarket units. Though using a stock radio?? Not sure, sometimes it can be hooked up to a power antenna wire too, I'm sure somebody has the wiring diagram. If you do get an aftermarket head unit too, you won't need to speaker wire converter to hook up to the amp. It would just use standard "RCA" type connectors. About where to run the wires, there is not a "right" way to do it, more of preference, and just keeping the power wire not too close to the speaker wires to prevent interference (I don't know if that's actually a real-world problem).
And I'm a bargain basement scratch & dent kinda guy.. haven't had problems before, but I haven't done that with car audio. I did buy from Crutchfield and I can say they are very good!! If you were to have to ship it back for any reason all you would do is tape the box back up and stick the UPS label they already gave you and drop it off at the UPS place.
The remote turn on hooks into a blue/white wire on the back of the radio, at least on aftermarket units. Though using a stock radio?? Not sure, sometimes it can be hooked up to a power antenna wire too, I'm sure somebody has the wiring diagram. If you do get an aftermarket head unit too, you won't need to speaker wire converter to hook up to the amp. It would just use standard "RCA" type connectors. About where to run the wires, there is not a "right" way to do it, more of preference, and just keeping the power wire not too close to the speaker wires to prevent interference (I don't know if that's actually a real-world problem).
And I'm a bargain basement scratch & dent kinda guy.. haven't had problems before, but I haven't done that with car audio. I did buy from Crutchfield and I can say they are very good!! If you were to have to ship it back for any reason all you would do is tape the box back up and stick the UPS label they already gave you and drop it off at the UPS place.
January-26th-2003, 01:03 PM
#3
huh?
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Caracas,Venezuela
Posts: 871
A few answers from me 
.
First, are you going to use the stock HU? if so, I would strongly advice against that. Get a nice aftermarket HU, trust me, youll be glad you did. Check out the new Alpines.
About runing the wires, your main concern should be to run the RCA cables and the power wires separate from each other, most people run RCA on one side of the car and power on the other side. The power wire from the amp to the battery has to be a fused line(you probably knew this but I wanted to make shure
)
As for replacing the speaker wires, the stock wiring should be able to take the 50w fine, it depends on the person. I'm changing all of the speaker wires for my new system, but that's just me, I'm litle paranoid about sound quality, it might not make a diference but it makes me feel good.
If you're mounting the amps under the seats I think youll have to cut part of those vents (do a search for SirNuke, he posted some pics of his install under the front seats), I'm going to mount my amps under the seats too, it's the best place to mount them if you want to keep your trunk space.
As for what brands to look for, here are some: Alpine, JL, Infinity, Pioneer... those are just a few.
Oh, one more thing, STAY AWAY FROM SONY!!!
.First, are you going to use the stock HU? if so, I would strongly advice against that. Get a nice aftermarket HU, trust me, youll be glad you did. Check out the new Alpines.
About runing the wires, your main concern should be to run the RCA cables and the power wires separate from each other, most people run RCA on one side of the car and power on the other side. The power wire from the amp to the battery has to be a fused line(you probably knew this but I wanted to make shure
)As for replacing the speaker wires, the stock wiring should be able to take the 50w fine, it depends on the person. I'm changing all of the speaker wires for my new system, but that's just me, I'm litle paranoid about sound quality, it might not make a diference but it makes me feel good.
If you're mounting the amps under the seats I think youll have to cut part of those vents (do a search for SirNuke, he posted some pics of his install under the front seats), I'm going to mount my amps under the seats too, it's the best place to mount them if you want to keep your trunk space.
As for what brands to look for, here are some: Alpine, JL, Infinity, Pioneer... those are just a few.
Oh, one more thing, STAY AWAY FROM SONY!!!
January-26th-2003, 05:15 PM
#5
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ohio
Posts: 426
Thanks guys.
I am planning on using the stock HU because I got the 6disc changer and I like the larger buttons and the way it looks.
Chasten, the amp has speaker level inputs so I don't need converters.
Also I was thinking about mounting some more and I changed my mind and will probably mount the amp under the seat so I don't have to run wires as far.
I am planning on using the stock HU because I got the 6disc changer and I like the larger buttons and the way it looks.
Chasten, the amp has speaker level inputs so I don't need converters.
Also I was thinking about mounting some more and I changed my mind and will probably mount the amp under the seat so I don't have to run wires as far.
January-26th-2003, 05:15 PM
#6
Master of All Things :{D
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: southeast texas, near houston
Posts: 4,118
Okay....I can and will answer ALL your questions...
The alpine 4 channel you are getting is a nice amp....I got the 5 channel so that I could also add the sub....it accepts line level inputs directly from your speakers....
so NO, there isn't a PLUG that you just hook up to the back of the stock head unit...what you will have to do is one of two things...either buy two wiring harnesses for your car...a standard harness and a REVERSE harness and hook them up back to back with the exception of the speaker wires...then plut it into the cars harness and to the head unit and then you just have speaker wires to hook up....OR you can just cut the speaker wires and splice them for the wires going to the line level input plug for the amp...and then the speaker wires from the amp back to the harness.....
YES, run the power to the amp down one side of the car and the speaker wires back up either the center of the car or down the other side...keeping them seperated will eliminate you having alternator whine induced into the system...
yes keep the ground as short as posible from your amp to the body.....
Using this amp your stock speaker wires will be just fine....they work great.
As douggie mentioned...go to Wal-Mart and get a Scosche amp install kit for a 300 watt amp installation....it will have MORE than you need in it...and its right at $20.
The scratch and dent thing? as long as you are getting a warranty with it...go for it.
The remote wire...you can hook it up to ANY power source that is hooked up through the ignition...so that it is only on when you have the key in and on.....there is a wire right in the harness for your HEADUNIT....its PIN 10 and is PINK/BLACK splice the amp on/off lead into that wire....if you want to have a complete run down of the pinout for the stock head unit...go here.
. STOCK HEAD UNIT PIN OUT
There is one thing I disagree with .... and that is with JAC....by adding one of the Alpine V-power amps to your stock head unit and upgrading all your speakers....I personally do not believe you will be disappointed.....I did this very upgrade....and am VERY pleased with it
The alpine 4 channel you are getting is a nice amp....I got the 5 channel so that I could also add the sub....it accepts line level inputs directly from your speakers....
so NO, there isn't a PLUG that you just hook up to the back of the stock head unit...what you will have to do is one of two things...either buy two wiring harnesses for your car...a standard harness and a REVERSE harness and hook them up back to back with the exception of the speaker wires...then plut it into the cars harness and to the head unit and then you just have speaker wires to hook up....OR you can just cut the speaker wires and splice them for the wires going to the line level input plug for the amp...and then the speaker wires from the amp back to the harness.....
YES, run the power to the amp down one side of the car and the speaker wires back up either the center of the car or down the other side...keeping them seperated will eliminate you having alternator whine induced into the system...
yes keep the ground as short as posible from your amp to the body.....
Using this amp your stock speaker wires will be just fine....they work great.
As douggie mentioned...go to Wal-Mart and get a Scosche amp install kit for a 300 watt amp installation....it will have MORE than you need in it...and its right at $20.
The scratch and dent thing? as long as you are getting a warranty with it...go for it.
The remote wire...you can hook it up to ANY power source that is hooked up through the ignition...so that it is only on when you have the key in and on.....there is a wire right in the harness for your HEADUNIT....its PIN 10 and is PINK/BLACK splice the amp on/off lead into that wire....if you want to have a complete run down of the pinout for the stock head unit...go here.
. STOCK HEAD UNIT PIN OUT
There is one thing I disagree with .... and that is with JAC....by adding one of the Alpine V-power amps to your stock head unit and upgrading all your speakers....I personally do not believe you will be disappointed.....I did this very upgrade....and am VERY pleased with it
January-26th-2003, 07:05 PM
#7
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Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Atlanta, formerly Calgary
Posts: 363
Originally posted by Sir Nuke
There is one thing I disagree with .... and that is with JAC....by adding one of the Alpine V-power amps to your stock head unit and upgrading all your speakers....I personally do not believe you will be disappointed.....I did this very upgrade....and am VERY pleased with it
There is one thing I disagree with .... and that is with JAC....by adding one of the Alpine V-power amps to your stock head unit and upgrading all your speakers....I personally do not believe you will be disappointed.....I did this very upgrade....and am VERY pleased with it
Good luck with your setup!
Dale.
January-26th-2003, 08:49 PM
#8
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ohio
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Originally posted by Sir Nuke
NO, there isn't a PLUG that you just hook up to the back of the stock head unit...what you will have to do is one of two things...either buy two wiring harnesses for your car...a standard harness and a REVERSE harness and hook them up back to back with the exception of the speaker wires...then plut it into the cars harness and to the head unit and then you just have speaker wires to hook up....OR you can just cut the speaker wires and splice them for the wires going to the line level input plug for the amp...and then the speaker wires from the amp back to the harness.....
NO, there isn't a PLUG that you just hook up to the back of the stock head unit...what you will have to do is one of two things...either buy two wiring harnesses for your car...a standard harness and a REVERSE harness and hook them up back to back with the exception of the speaker wires...then plut it into the cars harness and to the head unit and then you just have speaker wires to hook up....OR you can just cut the speaker wires and splice them for the wires going to the line level input plug for the amp...and then the speaker wires from the amp back to the harness.....
When I hook the power wires together from the 2 new harnesses do I connect the pink/black wires together and connect the amps remote wire to them too? Or do I leave them unconnected and connect the remote wire to the harness that will be connected to the stock harness while the wire coming from the HU will be connected to nothing?
January-26th-2003, 10:40 PM
#9
Master of All Things :{D
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: southeast texas, near houston
Posts: 4,118
Originally posted by Dermen
Ok, the 3 cars I have installed head units on had a seperate harness for speakers than the power wires so I kind of assumed that the Protege was the same way. Since its not, I will just have extra wires to connect, which isn't that big of a deal. I just don't want to cut the stock harness off. I did that before and it was a pain soldering wires together while sitting in a car. Plus the HU broke so I had to do it again when installing the new one.
When I hook the power wires together from the 2 new harnesses do I connect the pink/black wires together and connect the amps remote wire to them too? Or do I leave them unconnected and connect the remote wire to the harness that will be connected to the stock harness while the wire coming from the HU will be connected to nothing?
Ok, the 3 cars I have installed head units on had a seperate harness for speakers than the power wires so I kind of assumed that the Protege was the same way. Since its not, I will just have extra wires to connect, which isn't that big of a deal. I just don't want to cut the stock harness off. I did that before and it was a pain soldering wires together while sitting in a car. Plus the HU broke so I had to do it again when installing the new one.
When I hook the power wires together from the 2 new harnesses do I connect the pink/black wires together and connect the amps remote wire to them too? Or do I leave them unconnected and connect the remote wire to the harness that will be connected to the stock harness while the wire coming from the HU will be connected to nothing?
do you know what I mean by getting TWO HARNESSES? one regular one and one reverse harness? the regular harness is for hooking up an aftermarket head unit to your car....it will plug directly into your cars harness you have now....the reverse harness is for putting your stock head unit onto another car...so it has a plug that will go directly into the back of your shock head unit....BOTH harnesses have all the wires coming out of them....then you hook them up back to back so that you end up with a male plug on one end and a female plug on the other.....then you hook up long speaker wires on the headunit side, those will go to the speaker level inputs on the amp...then you connect the speaker wires FROM the amp onto the other side.....you take the whole thing and plug the one side into the harness of your car....and the other into the back of your stock headunit....then you feed the speaker wires to where ever you have your amp.....PIECE OF CAKE. :{D
NOW....the second part of your quesiton...YES...you hook up both pink/blacks from both harnesses together and put the amps on/off wire with them...all three wires will be hooked together.
When I did my upgrade last fall I couldn't get the reverse harness....our cars were too new and no one had one available yet....both metra and scosche have part numbers for them......so I broke down and cut my speaker wires in my stock harness...but what I did was to use bulletnose connectors on all my speaker wires so that I could just push them together...and if I ever had the need or want to remove the amp...I could take it all out and just plug it back together like stock and it was all done without cutting anything again.
January-27th-2003, 12:12 AM
#10
huh?
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Caracas,Venezuela
Posts: 871
It all depends on what you want to do, if you're serious about SQ then aftermarket HU is the way to go, if you just want a sound system that's better than stock and sounds good, then youll be fine with the stock one.
Me, I don't like stock HUs, I like to have control over everything, SQ is my main goal and I also prefer the look of aftermarket HUs.
Since he wants to keep the stock HU, then what you sugested is what he should do.
Good luck with the install .
Me, I don't like stock HUs, I like to have control over everything, SQ is my main goal and I also prefer the look of aftermarket HUs.
Since he wants to keep the stock HU, then what you sugested is what he should do.
Good luck with the install
.
January-27th-2003, 12:17 AM
#11
formerly chastan
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 2,350
The amp is a really good upgrade to start with. When you get more money (my guess is you don't want to spend ), then go about upgrading the stock HU and sometime the speakers. But don't worry you'll like the amp by itself
), then go about upgrading the stock HU and sometime the speakers. But don't worry you'll like the amp by itself
January-27th-2003, 07:23 AM
#13
Master of All Things :{D
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: southeast texas, near houston
Posts: 4,118
Originally posted by Dermen
Sir Nuke, I understood what you were saying. I think I just confused you when I was talking about the other cars that I have installed head units on. I drew up a pic.
Sir Nuke, I understood what you were saying. I think I just confused you when I was talking about the other cars that I have installed head units on. I drew up a pic.
the only thing I don't know about in the image is the "POWER WIRES".....as the power supply to the head unit is part of the cars stock harness, so once you make YOUR adapter...and plug it all in...the head unit has power.
when you find the harnesses you need.....please post as to where you found them.....what brand they are.
January-27th-2003, 07:32 AM
#14
Master of All Things :{D
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: southeast texas, near houston
Posts: 4,118
Originally posted by JAC
It all depends on what you want to do, if you're serious about SQ then aftermarket HU is the way to go, if you just want a sound system that's better than stock and sounds good, then youll be fine with the stock one.
Me, I don't like stock HUs, I like to have control over everything, SQ is my main goal and I also prefer the look of aftermarket HUs.
Since he wants to keep the stock HU, then what you sugested is what he should do.
Good luck with the install .
It all depends on what you want to do, if you're serious about SQ then aftermarket HU is the way to go, if you just want a sound system that's better than stock and sounds good, then youll be fine with the stock one.
Me, I don't like stock HUs, I like to have control over everything, SQ is my main goal and I also prefer the look of aftermarket HUs.
Since he wants to keep the stock HU, then what you sugested is what he should do.
Good luck with the install
.
Another big PLUS to this upgrade....is as long as the quality if the sound you get is acceptable to you.....and for me it is.....when the THEIF comes along cruising the parking lot....and they walk by the car and peek in my window.....all they see is a stock system...and nothing fancy, or special.....they can not see the amp....nor can they see the sub. so unless they KNOW who I am ....and know what I have done.....nothing that they can see through my windows looks very appealing.
January-27th-2003, 07:41 AM
#15
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ohio
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The "power wires" are just the wires that aren't speaker wires. I couldn't think of anything else to call them. They would be the wires from pins 9-13. Also where it says speaker, that is just a label for the wires. There aren't actually speakers there.
When I find the harnesses, I will post where I got them. I was thinking about trying to get a stock harness that somebody had cut off instead of hunting for a reverse harness. But I think if somebody did that they wouldn't leave much wire on there. Maybe I can find somebody who is about to do an install and will leave a little extra wire on there.
DaleK, how do you mount the amps to the seat? I read the entire thread on the woox and all you said was that you mounted it to the seat. Do you just mount it upside down and does the bottom of the seat have something solid to mount it to?
When I find the harnesses, I will post where I got them. I was thinking about trying to get a stock harness that somebody had cut off instead of hunting for a reverse harness. But I think if somebody did that they wouldn't leave much wire on there. Maybe I can find somebody who is about to do an install and will leave a little extra wire on there.
DaleK, how do you mount the amps to the seat? I read the entire thread on the woox and all you said was that you mounted it to the seat. Do you just mount it upside down and does the bottom of the seat have something solid to mount it to?
Last edited by Dermen; January-27th-2003 at 08:12 AM.