More for less with no Explosions?
May-9th-2006, 06:04 PM
#16
Moderator/ Pocket Tuner
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Tampa,Fl
Posts: 4,150
Originally Posted by straydoginc
What is the maximum known size I can bore the cylinder to up the piston ratio?
this ain't no small block chevy
May-9th-2006, 06:33 PM
#17
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 778
You can hit 200 whp on an FS NA. WHP remember not crank you need to make yourself clear here, it does take an awfull lot of work but it should be streetable. Its alot easier to make that much at the crank. What you really want to do is raise the rod ratio, so it can rev properly.
Now if you want that power easy what you need to do is the kl-ve v6 swap and enjoy the new found power. (it uses stock fs mounts)
Now if you want that power easy what you need to do is the kl-ve v6 swap and enjoy the new found power. (it uses stock fs mounts)
May-10th-2006, 01:04 AM
#18
The man behind the mask
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 11,572
it will be VERY hard to hit 200whp on an NA fs-de without some serious coin.
Look at twillightprotege and how much he's spent for his 160-ish whp or so....
ported heads ($1200)
custom ground cams ($400+)
4-2-1 header ($400+)
cam timing gears ($350-450)
Engine management to control fuel ($unknown)
built shortblock with custom piston/rods/crank ---- THOUSANDS
Just FYI, my IDEA (doesn't actually exsist yet)... is to remove the ECU fuel/timing control by replacing the head with an older probe/626 head with distributor and create a 4-2 intake manifold with a weber or OER sidedraft carb for fuel control. This would allow the user to tune fuel and timing as they wish and add Nitrous with the safety of a timing retard box.
think OER sidedraft carb, full timing control, MSD6AL ignition, 4-1 header, 4-2 intake manifold, j-spec cams and you'll have your 180-200whp on a STOCK BLOCK.
Look at twillightprotege and how much he's spent for his 160-ish whp or so....
ported heads ($1200)
custom ground cams ($400+)
4-2-1 header ($400+)
cam timing gears ($350-450)
Engine management to control fuel ($unknown)
built shortblock with custom piston/rods/crank ---- THOUSANDS
Just FYI, my IDEA (doesn't actually exsist yet)... is to remove the ECU fuel/timing control by replacing the head with an older probe/626 head with distributor and create a 4-2 intake manifold with a weber or OER sidedraft carb for fuel control. This would allow the user to tune fuel and timing as they wish and add Nitrous with the safety of a timing retard box.
think OER sidedraft carb, full timing control, MSD6AL ignition, 4-1 header, 4-2 intake manifold, j-spec cams and you'll have your 180-200whp on a STOCK BLOCK.
May-10th-2006, 08:35 AM
#19
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Atlanta, Ga
Posts: 42
kl-ve v6 swap <-- That will fit right into the Protege 5 engine bay? Whats the $$ on this thing?
I may have asked the wrong questions. If I replace my pistons I need to choose a size or compression ratio to move to. Currently the engine runs a 9:1 and if I can get to a 12-14:1 on 93 octane I get a 10-12% increase in HP off the bat. What's the highest compression I can run for 93 octane?
If I keep reading right also, the intake manifold has a Long - Short setting where I can switch it to short and loose my below 3,000RPM HP and make more on the top end reving. Anyone heard of or done this?
I think with those two and replacing the pully systems with some lighter componets and maybe a clutch/flywheel change I might be in for a good start.
What in the world is a sidedraft carb? Are you suggesting adding a carboreutor system in the EFI ?? 
Also What are the possibilities in switching / programming my ECU for 93 octane since ill need to pull the compression switch and all.
I also noticed that I have a front mount Cat and a rear Cat. Do they both have sensors and what can I do about getting rid of one? Possible to still pass emissions?
not much....most anyone has done to my knowledge was simply hone the cylinder in a rebuild....cylinder walls arent exactly thick...
this ain't no small block chevy
this ain't no small block chevy
If I keep reading right also, the intake manifold has a Long - Short setting where I can switch it to short and loose my below 3,000RPM HP and make more on the top end reving. Anyone heard of or done this?
I think with those two and replacing the pully systems with some lighter componets and maybe a clutch/flywheel change I might be in for a good start.
Just FYI, my IDEA (doesn't actually exsist yet)... is to remove the ECU fuel/timing control by replacing the head with an older probe/626 head with distributor and create a 4-2 intake manifold with a weber or OER sidedraft carb for fuel control. This would allow the user to tune fuel and timing as they wish and add Nitrous with the safety of a timing retard box.
Also What are the possibilities in switching / programming my ECU for 93 octane since ill need to pull the compression switch and all.
I also noticed that I have a front mount Cat and a rear Cat. Do they both have sensors and what can I do about getting rid of one? Possible to still pass emissions?
May-10th-2006, 10:59 AM
#20
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Posts: 130
Originally Posted by straydoginc
kl-ve v6 swap <-- That will fit right into the Protege 5 engine bay? Whats the $$ on this thing?
kl-de or kl-ze are mazda 2.5 liter v6, that will fit directly into the protege. . . on the mount side, you are looking at a full ecu overhaul complete with wiring. Kl-de is the us version of the v6 with lower compression making around 160 hp, you can yenk the thing out of just about any probe or mx-6, ive heard very good things about the motor handling boost. Basically you need a motor, tranny, axels and ecu plus a few other things.
The KL-ze is the jdm version of the motor that makes 200hp at the crank running higher compression a differance intake mani and a very differant ecu, same deal with the swap. . . **** tons of electical work.
You can do the complete swap into a protege for estimated around $4000 for the klze and a little less for the klde
Check out this link on the quebec forum, its got some good stuff on it including pics
http://clubprotegequebec.com/forums/...8777#post98777
May-10th-2006, 11:09 AM
#21
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 778
The KL-ze would actually be a bit easier OBDI. So less wiring.
Installshield was able to do 200whp but he redid his bottm end and is running 93 octane @13:1 compression. The current thinking is to swap to the FP crank so it can rev easier. This should get you most of the way there, with tunning and rasing the compression. MAM is also releasing a destroked crank, were talking at least an 8000rpm redline.
Theres a bunch of guys running race pro's with 220whp using a microtech standalone, no idea what else they did, so its not inpossible. Which reminds me get a standalone ecu. THe stocker is garbage. Thats gonna be alot of power right there.
We do have a 2 stage intake manifold a single runner design would net a bit of power. There selling them over at protegegarage, its basicly a ported 626 manifold. Cams are gonna be a must whatever happened to the amazing wagner cams that were going to skyrocket power, I know wagner bad but it would have been a nice chunk of power.
Installshield was able to do 200whp but he redid his bottm end and is running 93 octane @13:1 compression. The current thinking is to swap to the FP crank so it can rev easier. This should get you most of the way there, with tunning and rasing the compression. MAM is also releasing a destroked crank, were talking at least an 8000rpm redline.
Theres a bunch of guys running race pro's with 220whp using a microtech standalone, no idea what else they did, so its not inpossible. Which reminds me get a standalone ecu. THe stocker is garbage. Thats gonna be alot of power right there.
We do have a 2 stage intake manifold a single runner design would net a bit of power. There selling them over at protegegarage, its basicly a ported 626 manifold. Cams are gonna be a must whatever happened to the amazing wagner cams that were going to skyrocket power, I know wagner bad but it would have been a nice chunk of power.
