gottacatchup

In truth i've always wanted a mazdaspeed protege but the practicality of a pr5 won out in the end. Now i'd like to install a turbo on my pr5 buuut i want a worthwhile gain. I've been told that most turbos wont make decent power without changing internals, do i really need to replace my cylinders, cams, valves, etc...?

and then which kit is the best?

macdaddyslomo

you need to do some serious research on engine modifications and turbos before taking on such a task. It is a major mod and by the nature of your question, you have little to no experience in such matters. a turbo will provida a HUGE gain, like around 40-50 hp on low boost. the internals being changed would be to prevent failure, not make power. best kit is really based on opinion, but the most tried and true is the begi turbo kit from flyin miata.

Roddimus Prime

I think you guys know where I stand, but I'm going to recommend the Wagner Motorsports Turbo Kit. You could basically swap the FMIC for the new AEM ecu and run safer than any other turbo car out there even though it's non-intercooled. Also the intercooler can be added later on.

Engine management is the BIGGEST part of turbo reliability. It's the MSP doesn't have and other turbo-kit manufacturers only add more fuel to control problems. While it works for low boost applications it's only a band-aid fix. Getting the AEM ecu will give you the biggest bump in power and provide it safely.

Topher

what's your view on the HiBoost kit, mattie?

Roddimus Prime

well Tofer, I think hiboost makes a lot of power, but how does it do it?? T3 turbo (same as everyone else), FMIC (same as everyone else), voltage clamp (same as a few of the others), RRFPR (more fuel, less tuning).

All in all, they do what everyone else does only they charge a lot more for it. Isn't the HiBoost kit like $4500?? The wagner is $3200 and thats without the AEM ecu...you can add the AEM to it and have the ULTIMATE set-up for almost the same price.

What would you rather have?? A voltage clamp and an ***-ton of fuel or a complete, programmable ecu that can controll every aspect of the engine PLUS turbo functions, knock control, timing control, BOOST CONTROL, traction control,...you heard right...traction control on the AEM.

My mind is made up.

markmurray77

Are you serious or just the king of misinformation. The Hiboost kit doesnt use a T3 nor does it use a RRFPR. It uses the HAltech F10

I would also suggest looking at the www.essentialspeed.com kit as they have software available as well. From what I have seen from wagners I havnt been to impressed other than their prices. The system seems to be a little thrown together. Its a nice system for the price but I wouldnt compare it to any of the others out there.

Roddimus Prime

I must be misinformed then. I've not heard of anyone using the Haltech on the hiboost. Also, I've never heard anything about ES having anything other than a basic fuel control set-up.

My experience has been more extensive with the wagner stuff. I have also seen their AEM ecu which can be used to control EVERYTHING. From what I hear the Haltech is a standalone and the AEM runs in parrallel. what size Turbo does the HiBoost use? Honestly I'd be hard pressed to think a stock block hold anything more than a T3 could throw at it. I have seen t3/t4's on P5's before but they are running almost no boost. I prefer a smaller turbo working at the peak of it's efficeincy range.

markmurray77

To start, Hiboost kits come with eth Haltech F10, a fuel compuer, with an options of upgrading to the E6X. They also use and IHI BB turbo. In terms of turbos there have been great leaps and bounds in the last few years which have produced far better turbos suited for different applications. I would think from your response that you would be more interested in a GT25 or maybe even a GT28R or maybe even a GT28RS. Spool up time has been educed on these significantly and you wont get past the upper limits of a GT28RS on an FS motor that will be in any way streetable. I am not knocking the wagner kit, for the money its a great alternative. But some of other kits should get some consideration. I assume you are in some way sponsored by them and is why you are pushing their products. I would just like for people to make informed decisions based on facts not on guesses from someone who is supposed to know what they are tralking about being a moderator of the FI section and all.

Roddimus Prime

I'm sorry I don't know the in's and out's of every manufacturers products. it was not a requirement for me to get mod status.

I love the GT28R turbo. It is ideal for all of my street cars but one. The other one is running a T3/T4 and over 26psi. The GT28R won't flow that much.

My point earlier was that I have seen Wagners AEM ecu up and running on both NA and FI cars. It truely is a night and day difference in not only power but driveabiliy. I have spoken with two people who have owned the Haltech E6K (I believe) and they both told me it was so difficult to use they wanted to sell it for the AEM. I don't know about that, just what I've heard.

I'm not sponsored by Wagner nor am I an employee of any kind. I'm merely a good friend of Nick who is the AEM tuner and I offered to handle all of his gorup buys and product sales on the forum while he finishes up several projects he's working on. Nick has helped me out in the past and I wanted to return the favor.

The reason I promoted the Wagner kit is because I've seen it in action on a mp3 with turbo and it would flat out embarass ANY numbers put out by HiBoost. FWIW, my NA p5 will make more horespower at the wheels than the Hiboost kit at 8psi. This is also at a cost of only about $3K to me. $1500 for the AEM, $575 for race NA cams, $600 for the full wagner exhaust. I already have an intake. On the stage 2 cams with pump gas we made over 180whp....with the race cams and 100 octane it jumps to over 200whp and can be increased beyond that if you want to get into the block. I've seen Wagners products, thats why I support them.

Topher

Mattie...yeah, the HiBoost does use a Haltech...and it's $4k...it has a nice fmic...puts down some REALLY nice #'s...i've heard nothing but good things out of the HiBoost...i don't know anyone with the Wagner kit...and Spool sucks (IMO)...i know the guy that owned it sold it to someone...but i've seen their kits and i'm not impressed...it looks like a 3yr old went crazy with some pipes and a welding machine. i don't know which way i'm going yet...i'll figure it out soon enough

Roddimus Prime

Wagner just released his first of NA p5 dyno numbers today in the first few configurations...I'll post more details in my AEM thread.

The Wagner turbo kit is a great piece and with some polishing and coating can look show quality.

markmurray77

i realize that there AEM is great, I also know that the AEm is really easy to tune. On another note I know that the AEM has a lot of flaws. If you check with some people who have been using it for a while you may be interested to see this. I believe the Supra crowd would be able to explain this better. But I have come across several people with problems with this unit. Hopefully all has been worked out. Hopefully he can get the turbos up in the 300+ range where they should be. I know ES has a few there and Im glad to see that more people are exploring a basically untapped market.

macdaddyslomo

regardless of tuning i wouldnt trust those stock connecting rods past 260-270 lb-ft of torque. I can just see the image of that rod punching thru the block..*shudders*

Topher

which is why i'm going with forged rods, f/i pistons, f/i cams, new lifters and springs...just so i'm not afraid of blowing **** up...i'll probably get the kit early summer, rods and pistons the following month, and have those installed...then get the cams, springs and lifters.

macdaddyslomo

getting a new head gasket too ?? stocker will NOT hold that much boost very long