Gene

I'm looking for a new daily driver and the first generation Protege has made my short list.

Requirements are:
1. Cheap
2. Reliable
3. Affordable to maintain
4. Reasonable economy
5. Fun to drive
6. Decent acceleration
7. Decent handling
8. Decent brakes
9. Reasonable Comfort
10. Bottomed depreciation curve.

I have found a presentable, solid '93 LX / 5 spd w/ 115,000 ml for $1200.

My experience tells me that engines of this family often last upwards of 200,000 ml in a Miata. I see no real reason to expect less in a Protege exept the average owner is likely less maintenance conscious.

Other than being a daily driver it may find itself pressed into service for STS Auto-X or Track Day / Driver School type events on occasion.

To be honest my first thought was a SE-R, Civic Si, or 318iS but the ragged-out, over-priced cars I have found and the high maintenance cost in the case of the BMW has given me second thoughts.

The Protege seems to be a very good deal for a decent car.

Any opinions, thoughts, or advice?

Davard

My '90 Protege has been autocrossed for all the almost 13 years I've owned it. I finally had a problem at 180k miles, when I suffered the same type of crank failure as the '90 Miatas were susceptible to (woodruff key and keyway failure). I've gotten about 27-28 mpg since new (it's gone down in the last 4 years as it has gone from mostly daily driver to full-time autocrosser). Otherwise, it's been a very reliable car.

For autocross, it has tons of potential. I won my very competitive region in STS in 2000 and have finished 2nd the last two years. At the last autocross, Proteges (or Escort GT--same car) finished 1st, 3rd, and 5th in a 27 car class.

With stock power, the brakes are easily up to the demands of track days. I've done several track days at Buttonwillow, and other than running out of pads (but it still stopped :-) ), I've never had a problem.

If you do a search, you will find that there is lots of STS setup info here, or we'd be happy to repeat it. $2000-$2500 (including tires and wheels) would prepare a car capable of trophying in Topeka, while half that would make you very competitive locally.

The car you've found is pretty a good base. You will need to do some maintenance at 120k (timing belt, water pump, valve cover and any other leaking gaskets) which is an easy weekend project.

mazdaspeedwest

Well, mine has only been raced for the past year, but has been my daily driver since new. Have only had the normal issues, nothing major. It's honestly the best car i owned so far.

and not only the last autocross did we finish 1st, 3rd and 5th but year end standings are near identical....1st, 2nd and 6th out of 49 STS cars.

protejay

I'm convinced that the 1st gen is one of the most underrated and BEST cars of its era out there. 93 LX with just 115K for $1200!?! ... One of the best 4cyl's mazda has ever made, 4-wheel discs, front/rear anti-roll bars, fun, solid, good looking, and has all the power accessories. If its been decently maintained, i don't think you can go wrong.

I've had mine since new; now its over 200K (see below). I JUST replaced the clutch for the 1st time @ 195K. i think it could have lasted even longer, but the rear crank seal needed replacing. I've replaced one axle, and a boot on the other, the plastic radiator finally cracked a year ago - got a replacement over the 'net, and the thermostat went out under warranty. Other than normal tune-up stuff, that's pretty much it!
I am a little concerned about the short-nose crank issue on my pro. It's pretty much un-documented for us compared to the 90-91 Miata. I don't know if and when Mazda changed the crank design on the Pro...it could be the 93 has a larger crank snout Whatever the case i don't mean to scare you away as my crank bolt was removed about 25K ago to replace the front seal and i have yet to notice any problems. Davard in fact is the only one i know that has had the failure. For that matter there is the 'loctite' fix for the problem....AND i'm not going to be too upset if after 12 years and 200K i need to spend some money on an engine that has otherwise been trouble-free!!

Anyways...for that price and with 115k i'd say go for it!

5SpeedP5

i will agree with all this, the 1st gen is a great little car.... but the classic SE-R is also somethin to look at (sr20deforum.com for more info) its strong and a little better performer in each area, and has load of gobbing aftermarket parts available! but it comes down to mazda vs. nissan, 2door vs 4 door.

superdave

And also cost. I doubt a nice SE-R could be had what that LX is going for.

5SpeedP5

yep tahts the prob too... mine which is in perfect like new condition with 38k miles (when i bought it) costed $4600.... blue book is about 6 i was told then.

ive seen decent ones iwth 80-100k miles with no problems going for 2-3 grand.... its just a price you pay i guess, if you realize the potential and overall value of the engine and car overall you'll understand. the sr20de engine is very capable, and responds well to boost... hehe but really its probably the most over build 140hp 4cylinder engine you will see stock, everything forged and counterweighted.... its strong and its beautiful... check out sr20deforum.com to see what we guys are doing with our se-rs.

either way though, ill gaurantee you both cars are awesome cars, especially for first cars! so dont worry too much get what you can affford, and like.

protejay

the 2.0 SR20DE is a GREAT engine...but so is the 1.8 BP : - not that your saying the BP isn't good . i just had to make the counterpoint...
Ric on the miataforum has gotten ~450hp out of the BP on its stock forged internals!!

In fact i don't see why in the world mazda didn't put the newest(miata) version of the BP in the third gen P5's and ES's. Actually i *think* i know why....cost. cheaper to just use the FS-DE...

just another point as far as 1st gen economy....i've gotten as much as 450 miles highway driving on a tank of gas - that's roughly 34mpg. However since i've taken out the stock airbox and installed the RX7 VAF + cone filter; i've noticed a significant difference in mileage - getting about ~80 miles less to tank. that's a rough estimate....

superdave

I don't really know anything about the SR20DE motor... but I do know that the BP is built really well tool. Even if the SR20DE has more potential, how much power do you need in a fwd car?!? The BP in my a opinion could achieve more than is sane for the size, weight, and for the fact that its a fwd car. No slight to the SE-R intended! I just think the LX is the better buy.

beachnut

I just bought my '94 LX last month for $1300. It had 153K miles but had been very well maintained. The car your looking at sounds similar to mine. (Click on the link in my sig line to see a pic)

For the past 5 years I've had two Accords and now an MPV minivan (which I traded for one of the Accords). I was tired of having two car payments, so I put my other Accord up for sale and bought the Pro. Since buying the Mazda MPV, I've been actively participating in the Edmund's forums and the MPVClub.com. Thru these forums I read about how reliable the Pro was, so it was my choice when I decided to buy what I thought would be cheap transportation. Well, it was cheap, but I got a whole lot more than I bargained for. I love driving this car and it brings a grin every so often that I never got out of the new Accords. Now that I come here and see what everyone else is doing to their Pro's modification-wise, I'm even more willing to plunk down some extra cash for a few more grins! Bottom line: BUY THE PRO!

5SpeedP5

well i guess i am very much a nissan guy, ive lost most intrest in my mazdas, atleast performance wise.... just seeing the greater potential of the nissan... the sr20de can be turboed easily for 400-500 bucks... i can pick up a factory turbo and manifold for about 250 bucks, and an intercooler and piping for another 200 or so..... and the possibility of 400+hp with out any internal work is just sick... and this is daily driven reliable power! talk about cool

but hey, go with whacha like, im not gonna try to push someone over

protejay

hey Andrew, i(we) respect your opinion!! after all, you DID find a nice SE-R.

also beachnut... your pro is looking good!

for the record since i was talking about what i've had to do to my pro...i did replace the rear calipers due to the parking brake not releasing. i got away for 5 years without using the parking brake before i finally swapped a wrecked 94's calipers in.

also some of the best info yet for a 'short nose' crank fix:
http://www.miataforum.com/ubb/ultima...c;f=5;t=023485

and some of the latest info on OUR crank:
http://www.miataforum.com/ubb/ultima...c;f=1;t=015303
RandyS(who KNOWS BP's) says the post 92 Pro's have the large nose....and thus nothing to worry about but as you can see there is still some unknowns about it.....TheMAN are you ready to do your thing??? :

superdave

I should chip in about the rear calipers...
Mine seized back in may (maybe june..) so that only one side of the caliper was applying pressure to the rotor. Well I guess it seized before that, but it was at this point that the one pad had worn down and started to grind on the rotor, while the other side looked almost new. The parking break wasn't stuck or anything either, the slider(hrm... i dunno the real name ) was just seized.
The cheapest price I could find on rebuilt calipers was $100 each (canadian) after core return. You can go to the mazda dealer and get a seal kit (or rebuild kit.. can't remember). It cost me about $40 (canadian) and it did both calipers. It wasn't to hard to do... Tricky part was getting some of the boots to fit on, etc. while everything was greased up.
Anywho my point is... If you can get to the problem before it does any major damage, it isn't a big deal and is fairly cheap to resolve.

Something else to note... I live in southern ontario and the car was winter driven all its life, and the roads hear are very heavily salted...

semtex

comming up on 300 000km and its runing fine, and nothing but normal wear and tear, i couldnt be any more satisfied (sp) and for 1200 (the same as i paid) i think that it is a steal i say go for it right away

Bizob

Whichever you choose, just the fact that both engines also come stock followed by a -T, you know you're on the right track... I've heard that the First gen Pro has better handling (as long as both are in relatively stock form) than the SE-R, although that may not be true...