itzkcatz

Yeah ive walked on a few dx proteges since i bought my car. (when it had a good clutch). And im not gonna beat a si civic anytime soon...Jon

TheLastMarauder

I think that race depends a lot on the color of the Protege.

itzkcatz

Ive found teal to be a quick color..Jon

UCSBgeek

Dave will have speed yellow pretty soon

sweetprotege93

I used to have a '93 DX and now I have a '93 LX. There is a pretty significant difference between the two. I'm talkin' about when my LX was stock... right when I got it I noticed that it felt a lot faster than the DX. It kept up with my friends cars a lot better too!

P-R-O-T-E-G-E

Not when the the redline on the car is close to 8000rpm. Torque and hp are going to intersect at different points on the line. Or did you forget about the high rpm difference. Its one of very few that redlines that high. But the BS flag can now happily burn in effigy!!!

Patio

its called vtec, if you ever drove an Si, I have, it pulls pretty nicely in the upper RPMs, VTEC kinda feels like a tiny shot of nitrous


and if you notice on that dyno, it made like 130whp stock, its rated at 160 hp / flywheel

P-R-O-T-E-G-E

Hmmm...you may have a point. So here is my new question which go's along with my old question: Do dyno test show crank hp or Whp?

Dayv

It has nothing to do with VTEC or high revs. All dynometers directly measure torque, not horsepower. Horsepower is derrived using the formula I posted above from the torque that is observed at any given RPM. When RPM = 5252 it cancels out of the equation and hp = torque, thus the curves always have an intersection @ 5252 RPM.

This is true on any car, from Geo Metros to F1 to top fuel drag cars.

I reiterate, that dyno plot is bullshit.

P-R-O-T-E-G-E

If of course you paid attention. Your bs flag is not valid according to the formula you posted. You see, you are absolutely right about the formula canceling out at 5252. HP should be equal to torque. However, if you paid attention to the plotting, they do match. Red dotted line indecates stock torque, which at 5252 is at about 108. And the solid red line denotes hp at about 108. Its probably a good idea check what your talking about before you plant your bs flag. The dyno is valid. Since we are looking at the hp curve you have to pay attention to all the factor. Especially before you make a "bs" smart remark.

Dayv

My appologies.

I didn't notice that they were using different scales for the hp and torque when I first looked at it yesterday, and made the assumption that they did use the same scale as they do in most of the dyno plots I have seen, for the sake of easier readability. However, VTEC and 8000 RPM redlines aren't correct explainations for the way that plot looks (as far as the not graphically intersecting at 5252), so don't act like you knew all along either.

I might come off as a smart *** sometimes and I don't mean to, but I'll be the first to admit it when I'm wrong.

P-R-O-T-E-G-E

I agree it took me a while to figure what was going on with that. I knew that the si had 160. I didn't know wether it was crank or wheel. Im glad that you handled this the way you did and didn't get assholish;makes me feel alot bettter about the whole forum deal. We all after all are here for the same reasons, to help each other, to provide advice, to correct, and enjoy our proteges!!! Understandable mistake.

I don't think that the protege can beat the si, however Im not to positive on the specs on the 1st gen protege's. Wtih the old emission standards and production capabilities of the 80's/early 90's, these =cars have potential to be alot faster than most expect.

Dayv

~Stock vs. ~stock, no way in hell unless you are racing for a very short distance or a very bad driver. To compete with a stock Si, I'd say you'd have to have enough mods to drop at least a second of a 1st gen Protege's (really any Protege's) ET. That is easier said than done, but it can be done. Most Si's that are going to want to race are not going to be stock, maybe ~stock, but not stock. In any given town there are going to be more Civics running 14's that Proteges running 15's. So, the 1st gen is going to need a little more help to keep up. It's not imposible though.

Civic Si's are not bad little cars. I'm not a Honda fan, but if someone gave me a deal on one I'd take it. People make fun of Hondas for their lack of torque, but look at how flat that torque curve is on the Si.

itzkcatz

That was prob the best post ever.. i wish all people on this board solved problems like that . Including myself. Def stock vrs stock a si civic will win. Or atleast should win.but they payed like 15grand more than u so come on now ...Jon

project626

I'll put it this way;

2000 Honda Civic SI
1.6L 160HP
V-TEC Engine
Redline 7600RPM's
Curb Weight 2600lbs



1993 Mazda Protege
1.8L 115HP
Redline 6400RPM's
Curb Weight 2445lbs



YOU MAKE THE CALL