Tweeaks

Whats going on guys?

I have a question about how likely it is to pass a lie detector test....

Someone that i know was raped, the police gave the person that raped her a lie detector test, and it came back inconclusive. Would that person be more likely to pass the lie detector test the second time because he knows what questions to expect?
He did pass the second test so does that mean that he is not lying?
What are the odds of someone being able to pass a lie detector test?

I really need to know something about this, because i'm ready to kill this guy.

I appreciate any answers

pr5owner

have a smoke to increase your blood rate, this isn't 100% effective but it helps. have like 5 smokes before you go in...

Tweeaks

that could be likely since the guy does somke......


man i'm so stressed out over this, i don't know what i should do.
I believe her, but then sometimes i don't. Not because it seems like she's lying just because....well i don't really know why.
I'm so confused, because right now we're haveing a baby
and i wanna do something about what has happened, but don't need to go to jail. Especially not right now.

i know about the test not being able to use in court.
I went with her to file the police report.
It took them about a month and a half to finally do anything about it (they tested him) then nothing has been done since.

Tweeaks

Oh......by the way if it matters the rape happened over 5 years ago, would that make it more easy for him to pass. Over time he can try to forget about it, and think that it never happened?

protetype

i think it's possible to believe what you tell yourself, even if it is not true and you know it's not true in the beginning.

jowettw

don't polygraphs measure your body's response to questions?

so it's not really detecting lies, it just detects your body's response to a question - and it uses that to determine whether you're lying or not.

so theoretically if the guy being polygraphed could comfortably lie or control his body's responses to the questions, then he would be able to pass it.

how a lie detector works

carguycw

Bingo.

I've read a few things about polygraph tests, and although I don't claim to be an expert by any stretch, just about everything I've read says that polygraphs work on the basic principle that people will experience emotions like guilt, nervousness, or regret when lying- emotions that cause physiological responses. The machine measures these responses. The problem is that some people can supress these feelings for various reasons. Such as...

1) Person has no guilt or regret because they have no conscience about the event. [Sociopath]
2) Person who lies so much that they have no unusual emotions or regrets about lying. [Pathological liar]
3) Person has totally rationalized or supressed the event to the point that they honestly believe an untrue version of what happened or why. [Various psychological problems]
4) Person honestly and totally believes something that didn't happen. [Schizophrenic]

You will notice that this means that the machine will often fail in the type of situations where it's needed the most. And yes, you can be trained to fool lie detectors, but it's not easy and requires real hands-on training.

IMHO the guy in the original post probably falls into Category #3, but #1 and #2 are possible also.

Pro_fan

As somebody who's taken a lie detector test (job prerequisite), I can say they are hella stressful. Personally, I don't think I could have lied and got away with it. As has been stated already, a lot depends on the competency of the tester. My examiner told me that the polygraph is more of a "truth verifier" than a lie detector.

I think after 5 years, one might be able to convince him/herself of whatever they wanted to believe and pass a polygraph test.

BTW, I passed my polygraph w/ flying colours by telling the truth.

Oh...almost forgot...here's a website that is very anti-polygraph. It's an interesting read, but I'm not sure if I agree with all of what they say.

http://www.antipolygraph.org/

There's an article somewhere on there that describes a "typical exam."

Pro_fan

I'd tell you...but then I'd have to kill you.

No...it's not a high end gov't position.

SteveO

I attend summer/fall classes at the USAF academy in Colorado Springs. Out of every graduating class they randomly choose 10 cadets and give it to them. Not to see if they have or will lie, but more of a scientific study.
i was also reading a memo last week that they will give polygraph evasion classes to pilots of the new F-22 (when its commisioned next year) and the new JAST. They are doing this so if they are shot down and captured their captors wont be able to find out info about the new fighters.
We have been teaching special forces, CIA, NSA and DARPA operators how to pass one with flying colors for years.
Its all based on how you perseve what did or did not happen.
To pass one you have to convince yourself a 100% even if its a lie.

I think its possible for the average guy to pass one if he just knows the basics of how to. Plus they are only like 63% acurate.

Identity_X

What if the definiton of a certain situation varies between two people? In his case, the guy might not have thought that he raped her. Say they had intercourse but it wasn't 'forced' on her. The lie-detector asks him "Did you rape her?" he answeres 'No' and passes because he truly *believes* that he has not. ...........and vice versa..........
What I am trying to say is: is it possible for two people to be asked the same question, answer differently, and still pass..... just because their definition of the situation is different, but in their minds completely *correct* .............

Pro_fan

I'd say yes since the test is based on the individual's physiological responses. I think this is part of the reason why the test can't be used as evidence in court.

fossil boy

Sort of like:

"It depends what the definition of 'is', is"...

hihoslva

It's interesting to note that not only can polygraph tests be "beaten" by controlling the "lie" responses, they can also be "passed" (usually with inconclusive results) by making EVERY answer a lie.

Basically, the tester asks some baseline questions to establish a person's normal physiological rythyms and resonses, and then measures the differences due to lies. If ALL of the responses show evidence of nervousness, etc., then there will be no true baseline to compare anything to.

And there you have your inconclusive results.

~HH

Tweeaks

What I am trying to say is: is it possible for two people to be asked the same question, answer differently, and still pass..... just because their definition of the situation is different, but in their minds completely *correct* .............


uhhmmm.... without actually saying what happened i can tell you for a fact that he knew it was rape.

Man everything was almost ok. When he found out that i knew he moved out of town. Now he recently moved back in town. I haven't seen him around yet, but it's a very small world. The next time i see this guy i'm gonna beat the **** out of him. I'm just afraid that i won't stop beating him that's how much i hate this guy.