You couldn't be any more correct then that. The next consideration (from a turbo kit supplier) is the cost of the parts. T25's are really cheap, mainly because of the way DSM guys give them away. That's an incredibly convenient feature for someone who is wanting to supply a kit to a market at a low cost! This wouldn't necessarily limit people because those who wanted to go faster could always upgrade to the larger and more expensive (almost 3x) T28 turbo, which wouldn't have a problem supplying most 2.0l with 18-20lbs of boost.

Personally, I would take the smaller turbo just for the less stress that it would put on the engine, while still providing a considerable amount of power increas and a nice driveable torque curve.

I've got the 1.8l.

So I guess when I look for a used turbo, I should mainly be looking at Eclipses?

Yep, they're a good car to start with. Lot's of used turbo's around. For a T25, you want to look for a '95-'99 Turbo Eclipse or Talon. For a 14B you want to look for a '90-'94 Turbo Eclipse/Talon/Laser with Manual tranny. For a 13B, look for a '90-94 Turbo with Automatic Tranny.

The 14b mentioned above is going to supply the most amount of boost. While the T25 is going to be a cheaper turbo and newer.

You'll want to get the BOV, O2 Housing, intercooler, and ALL hoses in addition to the turbo. Just to help out with getting started.

NOOOOOOOOO,:eek: The Eclipse turbo will not mate to the turbonetics manifold. THe turbonetics manifold it designed for a T3 turbo. THe only stock cars that I know of that used a true T3 are Saabs and Grand Nationals but I believe the GN is a T3/T4 turbo. So if you are looking for a used one look at Saabs if you plan on using the Turbonetics manifold.

What turbos do GMC's Syclone and Typhoon use? The same as the Buick GN?

Not sure about the GMC's I have heard they use a T2 but that is also a different flange as the T25 and not as effiecent....The T2 was one of Garretts lower turbos. Oh yeah for everyone thinking about getting my kit but wanting to put a T3 on later check out www.jgstools.com/turbo/ and they have a tool that will turn your T25 turbine to mate up with a T3 center section.

OH yeah forgot to mention in that last post....just think of the abilities of that turbo in that config....we all know the T3/T4 makes good quick boost from the T3 turbine and the huge T4 compressor. Well for our engines a T3 works fine but think of the T3 compressor with a T25 turbine spooling it....now thats something to ponder....:eek:

chdesign. Check out http://www.forcedperformance.com . They do some pretty cool stuff with the T25 housing and T28 wheels. They have a T28 version that's pushed a dsm into the 11's.

I think I feel another Boost is Boost issue like they have on probe talk....the only reason a bigger turbo woudl make more power at lower boost is if it is more effiecent. Any turbo and any given boost is flowing the same CFM to creat teh same level of boost. You cannot have more CFM at the same boost level with different turbos it defies the laws of physics. If you have a good intercooler or a CO2 spray over your intercooler when needed then a smaller turbo can generate as much power as a larger turbo given the charge air is the same.

I probably should keep my trap shut, but that's not like me. :-)

Actually ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL, if you switch to a larger turbo, you will generally get more power from the larger turbo at the same boost levels as the smaller turbo.

This is primarily due to the fact that the larger turbo isn't going to produce as much heat as the smaller turbo at the same boost level. (It actually gets deeper then this, you can underuse a turbo and likewise make it produce excessive heat)

Yes you can do things to cool the air temp down on the smaller turbo, but you can also do those things on the larger turbo as well. If you start with a lower temp, you'll always end up with a lower temp, under the same circumstances.

It's no arguement that the T28 is a better turbo then the T25. However, given the cost benefits of the T25, it would be stupid to overlook them.

Exactly I know a larger turbo is going to produce less heat but there is also space limitations for the design I made. Also if people decide it isn't enough boost for them they can upgrade from my kit. Since I am basing it on the T25 IE TD05H turbo. All of the 2nd Gen DSM upgrade will be available like the "Red Wheel" turbo that pushing DSM in the 11's. SO the kit doesn't just stop at the T25....and know you see another reason why I went T25 :bt:

Will you offer your kit without turbo?

Got any price estimates yet?

Without a turbo I'm not sure...I'm nto sure on teh final price yet I'm tryign to find someone that will sand cast my header and downpipe. And for all you who are wondering yes I will utilize teh stock cat for all your emissions people out there. I knwo its a huge sourse of backpressure but where I am i don't have a choice either. my car isn't 5 years old and it doesn't have 50,000 miles on it yet so I can't replace it just yet.

I like your style man!!