macdaddyslomo

Wrong again! You can run higher boost on high compression....again to avoid detonation it requires careful fuel mapping and a good intercooler helps too....low compression just leaves more room for error!! Low compression on turbo engines is just old school turbo...look at compression on newer stock turbos...you wont see those 7.0 to 1 compression ratios...Heck the MSP is 9.0 to 1....not high compression, but Mazda couldve easily went with some lower compression pistons to avoid reliability probs if it was really an issue

Roddimus Prime

you are both right, but I believe the person who started this post was looking to do this because cost and difficulty were big issues. If that is the case, lowER compression and higher boost would make more sense. It absolutly leaves more room for error which I believe is very important to us "DIY tuners". This has been my expereince anyways!

BOOSTD 7

Right ... boost on high-compression is the hot thing from OEM these days. But the reason why is because of the sophistication in ECU's. It's almost impossible for DIY tuners to match the precision and accuracy of an OEM model based ECU with an aftermarket map based ECU and a wide-band.

Sooo, still for the tuners, the best way to be safe is with lower compression on a boosted motor.

markmurray77

Its also because the manufacturers can just slap a turbo on something and charge a lot more

LinuxRacr

BTW...The compression in the MSP is 9.1:1. I used to have the FS-ZE engine (minus intake manifold) in my MP3 after the death of my 1st engine. I only saw a 7 hp gain on the dyno. After a few months of running this engine, I noteced one day that I was low on oil. I found out later that this happened due to cylinder wall scratches letting oil out. I also found out that my rod bearings got eaten as a result. You never know what you are really getting from Japan. If you are gonna get this engine, make sure you have some type of stand-alone ECU or the OBDI ECU from Japan. You will never pass emission again, but hey. I tried the FS-ZE engine out in my MP3 because it cost less than a new engine from Mazda. As far as turboing that engine, for the compression to run higher boost, you will need higher octane fuel all the time. You would only be able to run lower boost on pump gas. As a matter of fact, in N/A form, you would run 92/93 octane minimum!

StuttersC

Show me a high compression motor, higher than 10:1, on high boost turbo. High boost, more than 8 psi.

Then show me the fuel it is running. Pump gas? Nope.

Is it a daily driver?

As far as I am concerned, you are "wrong again."

Lower compression leaves more room for boost...Careful fuel and timing maps should be used no matter what once you get high end. Low compression allows for more boost than a high compression motor, regardless.

Cooler intake temps allow the use of more boost, that is true.


And the MSP does have reliablity issues as it is. And runs a low boost level from the factory as compared to other factory turbo'd cars...

macdaddyslomo

how many NA engines run higher than 10.0:1 compression....not many to begin with....and most factory turbos run an average of 6-9 lbs of boost...same as the MSP...look around, the 2nd gen Eclipse GST runs 6-9,the older MX-6 GT turbos run 6-9...My old Mercury Capri XR2 ran 6-9lbs of boost..the T-Bird Turbo coupes ran 6-9 lbs of boost....how much boost do you want to run anyway...20+lbs ??? how is that going to make for a "low-cost" tuner car ?? it wont!!!...and to make a point, If you know how to run one, an FS-ZE run by a haltech could def support 10-13lbs of boost !! so what is your definition of acceptable costs ??....one more thing.....low compression does NOT allow for more boost necessarily, more like more room for error on fuel delivery...the tolerance of overall static pressure inside the engine will be the same regardless of what pistons you use !!

StuttersC

None of the cars you mentioned run FS-ZE compression...Which is exactly my point. None of them are running more than 9lbs of boost and none of them have high compression.

FS-ZE running 10-13 psi of boost will not be on pump gas for long...Regardless of the engine management.

10.5 or 10.7:1 on 10-13 psi is a lot of pressure in the motor, and forged or not, something is gonna break...Regardless of fuel management. You would have to run super rich and retard the timing pretty good to make it run.

It seems to me to your are missing my point and I am missing yours.

premdrumusr

How about if you guys quit ur bickering. You want proof the FS-ZE will run high boost well here it is: I have a modified HKS turbo that was made for an RX-7 attatched to the FS-ZE in my 99 Protege ES. This baby's got a 5-speed and the whole set up was done by Mike Lowe at Lowe's Mazda Performance here in the area. I'm currently running 12PSI and about to go higher. I have had NO PROBLEMS with this car at all! I had my stock 1.8L in the shop every week, I was almost tempted to say never again will I buy another mazda!

premdrumusr

Dont mean to post again but I forgot to add this.. The whole thing with engine, custom fitted turbo, down pipe, high flow cat, intake manifold, exhaust manifold, intercooler and new Exhaust cams and underdrive pulley's came up to a heart stopping $6000US! That's $2800 for the engine and install and then $3200 for the turbo and install and all of that.. Not bad considering im running 13.6 @98 MPH in the 1/4 mile! Burnt up all that rice around here and ALL MSP's.. hmm.. Not only did I get my turbo'ed pro for 4 grand less then a MSP I'll BURN THEM ALL!! muhahahaha! sucks for mazda, they tried really hard.. oh well!

markmurray77

lets see some pics of the setup, I would also hope that you will be doing better than 13.6 with all those goodies

StuttersC

Yeah, some guy posting is proof?

What size is the turbo? What are you running for engine management?

Dyno's? At 12 psi on the FS-ZE I would expect you to run fatser times. Juan @ HiBoost has run that with extensive tuning and race gas...You should be putting down more power.

StuttersC

Mazda didn't try hard on the MSP, hence why some people think it has lack luster performance...

I can pull on stock MSP's as it is, no real feat there.

premdrumusr

I have no f-ing clue what the fool did exactly. I'll be honest.. I can't drive stick for **** yet; I burnt out up through 2nd, and stalled twice at the line (im good.. heh). I bought this thing from Mike Lowe and if anyone lives in Sarasota they have had to know Mike Lowe and knows about Lowe's Mazda Performance. Got 2nd overall in the Professional drags at Brandenton Motorsports Park for the NOPI not too long ago.. he's runnin a '76 white RX-7. The Protege was his project and I paid what the damn thing was worth plus $3200..If anyone's around go out there any Saturday and search for the Bright *** "lipstick red" Protege and then talk ur **** to my face while im laughing all the way down the track.

LinuxRacr

It would be hard to produce picture proof of the FS-ZE engine tuned unless he took pictures of the inside of the engine. When I had the FS-ZE it looked just like a regular FS-DE on the outside because I kept my stock intake manifold.