Another Strike
November-21st-2002, 10:19 AM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 1,122
Oh yeah, just thought of another common cause of rotor warpage. 
If you drive a Protege with rear disk brakes, do NOT set the handbrake when you park after doing a lot of heavy braking. If you clamp a really hot brake rotor with the rear brake pads, it will load the rotor unevenly and it may warp as it cools off. If you have been doing lots of heavy braking, park the car in gear and DON'T set the handbrake. I recommend parking on relatively level surfaces.
If you drive a Protege with rear disk brakes, do NOT set the handbrake when you park after doing a lot of heavy braking. If you clamp a really hot brake rotor with the rear brake pads, it will load the rotor unevenly and it may warp as it cools off. If you have been doing lots of heavy braking, park the car in gear and DON'T set the handbrake. I recommend parking on relatively level surfaces.
November-21st-2002, 10:53 AM
#32
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Saratoga Springs, NY
Posts: 33
I have 16k on my P5 and the brakes are still the best on any car I've ever known (4 way ABS).
Weak glass is a common thing, I believe, in the car industry as they strive for lower prices AND lower vehicle weights, which improve fuel efficiency.
Our parent's cars' windshields were much thicker pieces of glass, you'll notice, than most new cars have today...
Weak glass is a common thing, I believe, in the car industry as they strive for lower prices AND lower vehicle weights, which improve fuel efficiency.
Our parent's cars' windshields were much thicker pieces of glass, you'll notice, than most new cars have today...
November-21st-2002, 11:24 AM
#33
Slowtegé
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,425
I don't know about Passats but VW Jettas and Golfs aren't exactly known for their reliability, just check VWvortex.com's forums out. Rattles, squeaks, window regulators, O2 sensors, MAF sensors, the list goes on. Before you trade you might want to talk to Sporin here on the forums. He had a 99 Passatt which he traded in for his Pro5.
November-21st-2002, 11:50 AM
#34
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 77
All I can say from reading your previous postings is the Passat is NOT the car for you. You claim reliability is of the utmost importance to you...uuhm, don't go with a VW then.
I purchased a Passat new in 1999. Excellent car. Truly wonderful to drive, but it certainly was far from trouble free. Let's see, 30 months and 42,000 miles of ownership with the following:
1) Steering column and cover not cut to proper length, causing scraping noise while driving. Especially bad when extremely cold, or hot. Took one dealer three tries, finally took to another dealer.
2) Driver's side rear window actuator bad... new part only about $190.00, of course outside the wonderful 2 year, 24,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty.
3) Driver's seat frame rails needed replaced. Seat would move while driving. A lovely feeling I might add.
4) Driver's seat **** control to adjust seat angle would not hold the setting. (Never bothered to get it fixed)
5) Cruise control would not work consistently, dealer replaced, rewired, and finally replaced ECU, all to no avail.
6) Passenger side headrest began to rattle, actually sounded like a baby rattle. $190.00 for new head rest.
7) Leaky coolant line from a defective clamp (quite common on Passats)
All of these problems were for the most part, small and not safety related, but are a pain in the ***. Most conveniently happened shortly after the bumper to bumper expired.
Some other concerns to think about:
My Passat was actually pretty reliable compared to alot of them. But some other high costs are as follows...
To replcae the timing belt on either the V-6, or the Turbo 4 requires removing the front end of the car, costs range anywhere from $600-$1,000 depending on the dealer, or garage.
The cars are notorious for front control arm bushing failure, on both upper and lower a-arms. Bushing goes bad, only problem is, it is all one piece, must replace entire control arm. usual cost, about $1,200 for upper, OR Lower arms in a pair.
Water pumps...figure one for about every 20,000 miles. A bargain at around $250-300 installed.
Cars require Premium unleaded gas. My car was a V-6, 5 speed manual, I averaged about 24 mpg, vs. the 30 I get in my 02 ES.
The oil filter alone is in the neighborhood of $15-$25 depending where you purchase them.
Rear suspension is twist beam, except 4 motion. Rear is not adjustable for alignment purposes. Lower the car too much, and the camber became excessive, eating rear tires for a light snack.
The car in stock form is quick, excellent crash rating, quiet, and a great car. I miss it alot. The highway ride was more akin to a Buick than our Protege's...lot's of float above 70mph, heavy nosedive, and generally the body motions were not as quickly or firmly damped. Aftermarket suspension was a priority.
The car price was around $25,000, for that same price, I now have two cars (see below) that never seem to have problems. Sure, they aren't as nice, but they are a blast to drive, and since most of the mileage is for commuting, pretty hard to beat. I didn't get rid of the Passat because of the problems, I'm used to European cars and the pain of ownership that goes with them. I did it purely for financial reasons...Two little girls that need a little more put into their college fund every month with a need for two cars for our family made the decision pretty easy. For the money, you simply can't beat a Protege!
Take what you will from a former Passat owner...all this keeping in mind the Passat is far more reliable than a Jetta, Golf, or New Bug, stay far away from one of those.
I purchased a Passat new in 1999. Excellent car. Truly wonderful to drive, but it certainly was far from trouble free. Let's see, 30 months and 42,000 miles of ownership with the following:
1) Steering column and cover not cut to proper length, causing scraping noise while driving. Especially bad when extremely cold, or hot. Took one dealer three tries, finally took to another dealer.
2) Driver's side rear window actuator bad... new part only about $190.00, of course outside the wonderful 2 year, 24,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty.
3) Driver's seat frame rails needed replaced. Seat would move while driving. A lovely feeling I might add.
4) Driver's seat **** control to adjust seat angle would not hold the setting. (Never bothered to get it fixed)
5) Cruise control would not work consistently, dealer replaced, rewired, and finally replaced ECU, all to no avail.
6) Passenger side headrest began to rattle, actually sounded like a baby rattle. $190.00 for new head rest.
7) Leaky coolant line from a defective clamp (quite common on Passats)
All of these problems were for the most part, small and not safety related, but are a pain in the ***. Most conveniently happened shortly after the bumper to bumper expired.
Some other concerns to think about:
My Passat was actually pretty reliable compared to alot of them. But some other high costs are as follows...
To replcae the timing belt on either the V-6, or the Turbo 4 requires removing the front end of the car, costs range anywhere from $600-$1,000 depending on the dealer, or garage.
The cars are notorious for front control arm bushing failure, on both upper and lower a-arms. Bushing goes bad, only problem is, it is all one piece, must replace entire control arm. usual cost, about $1,200 for upper, OR Lower arms in a pair.
Water pumps...figure one for about every 20,000 miles. A bargain at around $250-300 installed.
Cars require Premium unleaded gas. My car was a V-6, 5 speed manual, I averaged about 24 mpg, vs. the 30 I get in my 02 ES.
The oil filter alone is in the neighborhood of $15-$25 depending where you purchase them.
Rear suspension is twist beam, except 4 motion. Rear is not adjustable for alignment purposes. Lower the car too much, and the camber became excessive, eating rear tires for a light snack.
The car in stock form is quick, excellent crash rating, quiet, and a great car. I miss it alot. The highway ride was more akin to a Buick than our Protege's...lot's of float above 70mph, heavy nosedive, and generally the body motions were not as quickly or firmly damped. Aftermarket suspension was a priority.
The car price was around $25,000, for that same price, I now have two cars (see below) that never seem to have problems. Sure, they aren't as nice, but they are a blast to drive, and since most of the mileage is for commuting, pretty hard to beat. I didn't get rid of the Passat because of the problems, I'm used to European cars and the pain of ownership that goes with them. I did it purely for financial reasons...Two little girls that need a little more put into their college fund every month with a need for two cars for our family made the decision pretty easy. For the money, you simply can't beat a Protege!
Take what you will from a former Passat owner...all this keeping in mind the Passat is far more reliable than a Jetta, Golf, or New Bug, stay far away from one of those.
Last edited by KHH; November-21st-2002 at 11:55 AM.
November-21st-2002, 06:34 PM
#35
Protege Newbie
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 23
Re: Another Strike
Originally posted by ProtegeMaster
My goal is to, with great luck, find a late model used VW Passat. That is an excellent car. It's roomy, quiet, performs well, is of high quality, is reliable, and is a top rated mid-size vehicle. It's superior to Protege in almost every way. It will unfortunately have to be at least a year before I can move on that process, however.
My goal is to, with great luck, find a late model used VW Passat. That is an excellent car. It's roomy, quiet, performs well, is of high quality, is reliable, and is a top rated mid-size vehicle. It's superior to Protege in almost every way. It will unfortunately have to be at least a year before I can move on that process, however.
Since I bought a PR5 over the ES, I bought a japanese manufactured car rather than an american one like alot of the Mazda line is becoming. Maybe your continued criticism should be focused there. Modern American cars are made to last 4 years these days -- that way you spend a year gritting your teeth about how bad your car sucks and at the end of the loan you jump from one shitheap onto another.
November-21st-2002, 06:53 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 81
damnit
O.K. I recently posted on this subject. And since I got lambasted (is that even a word?). I'm here to deffend and offend. (I have a 2001 ES)
1. The Protege's brakes squeak- all the time!
2. My car squeaks like it has an interference problem. At first when turning right- then when turning left and now right/left AND straight down the road. NO IDEA what it is.
3. I've had my seat frame replaced- because it was shifting left or right (accompanied by a loud popping noise) on semi-hard turns. Now, after 10K miles it's started again...
4. You know, I'm tired of all the punks saying: "what an idiot- didn't you test drive it first?" Listen, all my windows rattle. They didn't do that for the first 5K miles. Same with my squeaking dash, groning rear suspension, rattling door... Jesus if I touch my radio **** too hard I can feel the thing shift.
5. The engine is loud! Much louder now than when I bought it.
6. The paint scratches if you LOOK at it the wrong way.
whew! I feel better. But we all know this. And I, like the guy who started this thread, am only saying I would like more. I thought this car would be better from all I heard about it. But when the days done- it's still an economy car. Hard lesson to learn really.
ALSO. I'm sick of people ripping apart the Passat. True the 90's weren't a great time to buy a VW. I had 2 Jetta's from that era and they had all kinds of problems.
My father bought a 99 Passat V6. And all I can say is that this car was the turning point. I love his car. Maybe more than he does- maybe. He's had excellent reliablitity up to this point ( I think it has around 50K). And the car oozes quality. From the leather seats to the real wood dash to buttoned down controls. First rate car in every respect. But what do you expect from an Audi!?
edit...dean80- Jettas are made in Mexico. Golfs and Passats are made in Germany.
1. The Protege's brakes squeak- all the time!
2. My car squeaks like it has an interference problem. At first when turning right- then when turning left and now right/left AND straight down the road. NO IDEA what it is.
3. I've had my seat frame replaced- because it was shifting left or right (accompanied by a loud popping noise) on semi-hard turns. Now, after 10K miles it's started again...
4. You know, I'm tired of all the punks saying: "what an idiot- didn't you test drive it first?" Listen, all my windows rattle. They didn't do that for the first 5K miles. Same with my squeaking dash, groning rear suspension, rattling door... Jesus if I touch my radio **** too hard I can feel the thing shift.
5. The engine is loud! Much louder now than when I bought it.
6. The paint scratches if you LOOK at it the wrong way.
whew! I feel better. But we all know this. And I, like the guy who started this thread, am only saying I would like more. I thought this car would be better from all I heard about it. But when the days done- it's still an economy car. Hard lesson to learn really.
ALSO. I'm sick of people ripping apart the Passat. True the 90's weren't a great time to buy a VW. I had 2 Jetta's from that era and they had all kinds of problems.
My father bought a 99 Passat V6. And all I can say is that this car was the turning point. I love his car. Maybe more than he does- maybe. He's had excellent reliablitity up to this point ( I think it has around 50K). And the car oozes quality. From the leather seats to the real wood dash to buttoned down controls. First rate car in every respect. But what do you expect from an Audi!?
edit...dean80- Jettas are made in Mexico. Golfs and Passats are made in Germany.
Last edited by sage11x; November-21st-2002 at 07:09 PM.
November-21st-2002, 08:41 PM
#37
Protege Enthusiast
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 180
You know, I'm tired of all the punks saying: "what an idiot- didn't you test drive it first?"
Go back and read what he complained about first. He's complaining about engine noise, poorly placed power lock button, and useless arm rest...which are stuff he should noticed when he test drove the car. I didn't blame him for the rattle and weak glass and I explicitly stated that in my post.
I'm sure there are some happy VW owners out there....just as there are some happy Neon and Cavalier owners as well. The question is...what's the chance of getting a good sample? That's the beauty of Japanese cars; the chance of getting a lemon is keep to a minimum. This is the reliability record for Passat in Consumer Reports where they gather stats from owners of all years/model.
November-22nd-2002, 12:53 AM
#41
Protege Enthusiast
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 180
For ppl not familiar with CR's legend:
Reliability history
For each model, this details the problem rates in 14 trouble spots, such as engine, transmission, brakes, and so forth. These data are derived from the 2002 annual survey of Consumer Reports' subscribers, covering experiences with about 480,000 vehicles. On the 2002 Annual Questionnaire, readers were asked about "serious" problems (on account of cost, failure, compromised safety, or downtime) that occurred between April 1, 2001 and March 31, 2002. Only models with sufficient responses are included. The data used to create the reliability history charts are standardized to minimize differences due to varied mileage. On average, the 2002 models included were less than six months old and had an average of only about 3,000 miles.
A model might have been designed during the eight-years (1995-2002) covered. Still past experience is a good indicator of how a model will age. To determine whether the vehicle you're interested in has potential problems that you need to check out, look at the trouble-spot judgments. As they show, the older models generally have more problems than the newer ones. And some components pose more problems than others.
With older vehicles, a score worse than average always merits scrutiny especially for critical areas such as engine and transmission. On newer models, such as those from 2001 or 2002, even an average or above average warrants caution. Have those components carefully checked before you buy.
What the trouble spots include
Engine: Pistons, rings, valves, block, heads, bearings, camshafts, gaskets, supercharger, turbocharger, cam belts and chains, accessory belts, oil pump.
Cooling: Radiator, heater core, water pump, thermostat, hoses, intercooler, plumbing.
Fuel: Fuel injection, computer and sensors, fuel pump, tank, emissions controls, "check engine" light.
Ignition: Spark plugs, coil, distributor, electronic ignition, sensors and modules, timing.
Transmission: Transaxle, gear selector and linkage, coolers and lines. Note: We no longer provide separate data for manual transmissions and clutches since we usually receive an insufficient number of survey responses for these items.
Electrical: Starter, alternator, battery, horn, gauges, wiper motor, wiring, lights.
Air-conditioning: Compressor, condensor, evaporator, expansion valves, hoses, dryer, fans, electronics.
Suspension: Linkage, power-steering gear, pump, coolers and lines, alignment and balance, springs and torsion bars, ball joints, bushings, shocks and struts, electronic or air suspension.
Brakes: Hydraulic system, linings, rotors and drums, power boost, antilock system, parking brake and linkage.
Exhaust: Manifold, muffler, catalytic converter, pipes.
Power equipment: Power mirrors, sunroof, windows, doors and central locks; cruise control switches, power and sensory seat position, heated seats, audio system, navigational system.
Paint/trim/rust: Fading, discoloring, chalking, peeling, cracking; loose trim, moldings; rust.
Body integrity: Seals, weather stripping, air and water leaks, wind noise, rattles and squeaks.
Body hardware: Manual mirrors, sunroof, locks and seat mechanics, windows and door operating hardware, loose interior trim, glass defect.
The reliability verdicts tell you at a glance which models and years have an overall reliability record that's average or better than average. The verdicts are on a relative scale, compared with the average for that year, not on the problem-rate scale used for the trouble spots (see above). We give extra weight to critical components--engine, cooling, transmission, and driveline.
Reliability history
For each model, this details the problem rates in 14 trouble spots, such as engine, transmission, brakes, and so forth. These data are derived from the 2002 annual survey of Consumer Reports' subscribers, covering experiences with about 480,000 vehicles. On the 2002 Annual Questionnaire, readers were asked about "serious" problems (on account of cost, failure, compromised safety, or downtime) that occurred between April 1, 2001 and March 31, 2002. Only models with sufficient responses are included. The data used to create the reliability history charts are standardized to minimize differences due to varied mileage. On average, the 2002 models included were less than six months old and had an average of only about 3,000 miles.
A model might have been designed during the eight-years (1995-2002) covered. Still past experience is a good indicator of how a model will age. To determine whether the vehicle you're interested in has potential problems that you need to check out, look at the trouble-spot judgments. As they show, the older models generally have more problems than the newer ones. And some components pose more problems than others.
With older vehicles, a score worse than average always merits scrutiny especially for critical areas such as engine and transmission. On newer models, such as those from 2001 or 2002, even an average or above average warrants caution. Have those components carefully checked before you buy.
What the trouble spots include
Engine: Pistons, rings, valves, block, heads, bearings, camshafts, gaskets, supercharger, turbocharger, cam belts and chains, accessory belts, oil pump.
Cooling: Radiator, heater core, water pump, thermostat, hoses, intercooler, plumbing.
Fuel: Fuel injection, computer and sensors, fuel pump, tank, emissions controls, "check engine" light.
Ignition: Spark plugs, coil, distributor, electronic ignition, sensors and modules, timing.
Transmission: Transaxle, gear selector and linkage, coolers and lines. Note: We no longer provide separate data for manual transmissions and clutches since we usually receive an insufficient number of survey responses for these items.
Electrical: Starter, alternator, battery, horn, gauges, wiper motor, wiring, lights.
Air-conditioning: Compressor, condensor, evaporator, expansion valves, hoses, dryer, fans, electronics.
Suspension: Linkage, power-steering gear, pump, coolers and lines, alignment and balance, springs and torsion bars, ball joints, bushings, shocks and struts, electronic or air suspension.
Brakes: Hydraulic system, linings, rotors and drums, power boost, antilock system, parking brake and linkage.
Exhaust: Manifold, muffler, catalytic converter, pipes.
Power equipment: Power mirrors, sunroof, windows, doors and central locks; cruise control switches, power and sensory seat position, heated seats, audio system, navigational system.
Paint/trim/rust: Fading, discoloring, chalking, peeling, cracking; loose trim, moldings; rust.
Body integrity: Seals, weather stripping, air and water leaks, wind noise, rattles and squeaks.
Body hardware: Manual mirrors, sunroof, locks and seat mechanics, windows and door operating hardware, loose interior trim, glass defect.
The reliability verdicts tell you at a glance which models and years have an overall reliability record that's average or better than average. The verdicts are on a relative scale, compared with the average for that year, not on the problem-rate scale used for the trouble spots (see above). We give extra weight to critical components--engine, cooling, transmission, and driveline.
November-22nd-2002, 07:50 AM
#42
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 77
So who ripped the Passat on these boards? I didn't see anything negative, merely some information.
Maybe you should go back and read my post again. Kind of hard to argue with as I am using 1st hand experience. The Passat is a great car, no doubt about it, however in pure statistical terms, the car is not as reliable as a Mazda Protege. Don't read anything else into this.
The original poster was complaining about reliability and quality problems, such as engine noise, weak glass, and some other things. Yes, the Passat will be significantly more quiet than a Protege, IT SHOULD BE, the car cost about $7,000-$15,000 more depending on how it is equiped. You purchased an economy sedan, albeit a very nice economy sedan.
All I'm saying is if you want a Passat, be prepared to spend some time in the shop, and be prepared for some expensive maintenance. If you can live these, then you will absolutely love the car.
Maybe you should go back and read my post again. Kind of hard to argue with as I am using 1st hand experience. The Passat is a great car, no doubt about it, however in pure statistical terms, the car is not as reliable as a Mazda Protege. Don't read anything else into this.
The original poster was complaining about reliability and quality problems, such as engine noise, weak glass, and some other things. Yes, the Passat will be significantly more quiet than a Protege, IT SHOULD BE, the car cost about $7,000-$15,000 more depending on how it is equiped. You purchased an economy sedan, albeit a very nice economy sedan.
All I'm saying is if you want a Passat, be prepared to spend some time in the shop, and be prepared for some expensive maintenance. If you can live these, then you will absolutely love the car.
November-22nd-2002, 03:15 PM
#43
Demands Perfection
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 344
Awesome, and Interesting!
Excellent post, firefly!
CR is my primary source for thorough automotive information. They compile better, more complete, ongoing data than anyone else.
To that effect, for those curious about my Passat interest, the Passat has demonstrated very good reliability, at least for the 2000-2002 models. The 2003's are coming up average, however, which isn't good enough for me. For, say, a 2000 model (built in Germany), that would be a reasonable risk in terms of buying a used car. I found one, an '00 with 5 speed, all other options (including leather!), and turbo 4, for $16,800. That's on par with the cost of a new ES Protege/P5. With a mechanic's assistance in assessing the mechanical soundness of a considered car, you could very well end up with an excellent value, and a decidedly superior car over my ES.
Also, to further clarify my previous posts, I never said VW was wholly synonymous with quality. In fact, VW has a longstanding history of building laughable, utterly unworthy, wretched reliability cars. They even proved it for years and years with the absolute worst warranty in the industry: 2 years/24,000 miles. For the longest time I sat amazed at how many saps were just falling all over themselves to buy a garbage Volkswagen because they thought they were just sooo cool-- I wouldn't have wasted my time farting on one, in fact, and I spent my time laughing while driving my trusty, and superior, Nissan Sentra (which was my old car until I sold it to a family friend-- They're still driving it with no problems, and they're very happy with it). As far as other cars, the Jetta and New Beetle are pitiful examples of reliability and I'd never waste my time on any of them. Same goes for the pathetic Golf. Utterly pathetic.
The VW situation has improved markedly in recent years, however, and much of that has to do with their cannibalizing Audi technology. As soon as VW started basing their core cars on Audi designs, low and behold, their quality improved. They started including warranties better than the industry 3yr/36,000 miles. And the Passat, yes, a Volkswagen, began demonstrating better than average reliability. 'Better than average' is my minimum qualification in a car. If it's anything less than that, it can F-off.
My '91 Nissan Sentra XE maintained a record of 'Better than average' reliability. The current generation Protege, as a whole, maintains a 'Much better than average reliability' record (which is the best, by the way). Despite the Protege being better in overall reliability, I was more satisfied with my Nissan than the Pro, because Sentra rode much more comfortably, it didn't rattle nearly as much, was easily quieter, and it was overall much more comfortable to drive (better seating, arm rest placement, no stupid-*** lock on top of the door, etc.). The B-13 series Sentras were excellent cars.
So, given that I was satisfied with a car that indeed offered less complete reliability, it was still good, and given that the Passat offers the same reliability that my Sentra did, the situation should, in theory, be the same.
Others' comments regarding more expensive repairs-- You're quite right. It's a European car. That's normal. As many others have also pointed out, though, you get a better car, you have to be willing to pay for it. I think that given my conservative driving habits (I've never really driven a car hard), and my dedication to keeping regular routine maintenance current, a Passat should hold up reasonably well. I never thought I'd be saying that, but the data is there, and I believe Passat is a good risk. And in my opinion, the Passat exudes an air of quality-- The interior is distinguished (the Protege's is too, I have to say!), built of high quality materials, and quite comfortable. About the only real thing I can see being unhappy about is its fuel economy and the necessity of Premium fuel-- Very irritating (and expensive).
In any event, I'll have to wait a year until I can afford anything else, anyway. Perhaps by that time another small car will come out that's worthy of consideration. At this point I can afford either a brand new small car, or a used mid-size.
CR is my primary source for thorough automotive information. They compile better, more complete, ongoing data than anyone else.
To that effect, for those curious about my Passat interest, the Passat has demonstrated very good reliability, at least for the 2000-2002 models. The 2003's are coming up average, however, which isn't good enough for me. For, say, a 2000 model (built in Germany), that would be a reasonable risk in terms of buying a used car. I found one, an '00 with 5 speed, all other options (including leather!), and turbo 4, for $16,800. That's on par with the cost of a new ES Protege/P5. With a mechanic's assistance in assessing the mechanical soundness of a considered car, you could very well end up with an excellent value, and a decidedly superior car over my ES.
Also, to further clarify my previous posts, I never said VW was wholly synonymous with quality. In fact, VW has a longstanding history of building laughable, utterly unworthy, wretched reliability cars. They even proved it for years and years with the absolute worst warranty in the industry: 2 years/24,000 miles. For the longest time I sat amazed at how many saps were just falling all over themselves to buy a garbage Volkswagen because they thought they were just sooo cool-- I wouldn't have wasted my time farting on one, in fact, and I spent my time laughing while driving my trusty, and superior, Nissan Sentra (which was my old car until I sold it to a family friend-- They're still driving it with no problems, and they're very happy with it). As far as other cars, the Jetta and New Beetle are pitiful examples of reliability and I'd never waste my time on any of them. Same goes for the pathetic Golf. Utterly pathetic.
The VW situation has improved markedly in recent years, however, and much of that has to do with their cannibalizing Audi technology. As soon as VW started basing their core cars on Audi designs, low and behold, their quality improved. They started including warranties better than the industry 3yr/36,000 miles. And the Passat, yes, a Volkswagen, began demonstrating better than average reliability. 'Better than average' is my minimum qualification in a car. If it's anything less than that, it can F-off.
My '91 Nissan Sentra XE maintained a record of 'Better than average' reliability. The current generation Protege, as a whole, maintains a 'Much better than average reliability' record (which is the best, by the way). Despite the Protege being better in overall reliability, I was more satisfied with my Nissan than the Pro, because Sentra rode much more comfortably, it didn't rattle nearly as much, was easily quieter, and it was overall much more comfortable to drive (better seating, arm rest placement, no stupid-*** lock on top of the door, etc.). The B-13 series Sentras were excellent cars.
So, given that I was satisfied with a car that indeed offered less complete reliability, it was still good, and given that the Passat offers the same reliability that my Sentra did, the situation should, in theory, be the same.
Others' comments regarding more expensive repairs-- You're quite right. It's a European car. That's normal. As many others have also pointed out, though, you get a better car, you have to be willing to pay for it. I think that given my conservative driving habits (I've never really driven a car hard), and my dedication to keeping regular routine maintenance current, a Passat should hold up reasonably well. I never thought I'd be saying that, but the data is there, and I believe Passat is a good risk. And in my opinion, the Passat exudes an air of quality-- The interior is distinguished (the Protege's is too, I have to say!), built of high quality materials, and quite comfortable. About the only real thing I can see being unhappy about is its fuel economy and the necessity of Premium fuel-- Very irritating (and expensive).
In any event, I'll have to wait a year until I can afford anything else, anyway. Perhaps by that time another small car will come out that's worthy of consideration. At this point I can afford either a brand new small car, or a used mid-size.
Last edited by ProtegeMaster; November-22nd-2002 at 03:21 PM.
November-22nd-2002, 08:37 PM
#44
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 133
Re: Another Strike
Originally posted by ProtegeMaster
My goal is to, with great luck, find a late model used VW Passat. That is an excellent car. It's roomy, quiet, performs well, is of high quality, is reliable, and is a top rated mid-size vehicle. It's superior to Protege in almost every way. It will unfortunately have to be at least a year before I can move on that process, however.
My goal is to, with great luck, find a late model used VW Passat. That is an excellent car. It's roomy, quiet, performs well, is of high quality, is reliable, and is a top rated mid-size vehicle. It's superior to Protege in almost every way. It will unfortunately have to be at least a year before I can move on that process, however.
they were impressed with the initial luxuriousness of their cars but after the short term the cars became crap...3 of the 5 owned the 2.0 4 banger golf/jetta/1 beetle and all needed new engines or rebuilding before 60k miles...the other 2 owned passats with the 3.0 v6...170hp was pretty paltry for such a large engine htat didn't last long, by 100k miles they were dead and had to be auctioned...i have a bud who races a 1.8t and constantly is working on his engine
jd power site (http://www.jdpa.com/studies/search.asp?CatID=1)
1998 (5 year old cars) vw isn't listed b/c its below the average of 355 defects per 100 cars sold...sorry but japanese just make better cars...and no matter the mfgr you can get a lemon (check your lemon laws in your area) and don't jump on look how pretty a vw looks b/c it wears off and you'll be poor with a poorly built car
