Arkos

http://www.mazdamp3.com/vbb225/showt...d&pagenumber=3

paulmp3

hey, thats me.
I dont browse this forum often but. yes they are having some problems, Im not sure if it is my dealer or the actual part but i spoke with another MP3 owner who got one put in and it took only 3 days. My dealer called mazdaspeed and they recomend sending out my new Speedo gear to be pressed on to the LSD instead of doing it locally, which is causing some delays. They say the part should be in tomorrow, but you know how that goes...... The other guy i talked to loves it. i cant wait to get my car back, i also got a new clutch and aluminum flywheel put in, so it should be a whole new feel. They said this all could have been avoided if they knew about the gear needing to be pressed on, they could have just sent it out and called me when it arrived. I will be sure to post once i get it in. The LSD cost me 625 plus labor. the list price is like 565 plus you need new bearings also. It is a much cheaper alternitive to the Quailfe, yet im sure its not as good.
Im am doing this because i will be turbo'ing this june. but either way the traction should be nice, especially with my AWR motor mounts.

TheMAN

wtf? your dealer is stupid... the VSS drive gear does NOT have to be pressed into the diff... it is just placed into the side of the diff (where the drive shafts go) and the bearings are pressed into it... the pressed bearings hold the VSS drive gear in place, "sandwiching" it between the bearings and the diff... you do NOT need new bearings if they are in good condition... they are the same on the LSD as the open diff.

carguycw

Sounds like what I said earlier.... nobody at the dealer in question knows how to rebuild a G15 tranny.

Jas00x

I think another thing that would help wheelspin is a bigger rear swaybar. Even though my shocks are very stiff, eventually it gets compressed fully and the front wheel wants to pick up a little. I think that with a bigger rear swaybar, wheel spin would minimized as well.
Basically what all the RWD cars- Miata, MR-S, S2000, BMW- do is put a big front swaybar on to keep the rear tires planted and reduce wheelspin.
Another thing- which I may do this year- is getting a longer shock (you can go + or - 1" in Stock Class), and sit the back of the car up a little higher.

It certainly would be a lot easier to get a Limited Slip Differential. I had a Quaife in my CRX when I used to race that- and I loved it!. However, the limited slip, without any other suspension mods, will probably cause the car to push, so you will probably need a bigger rear swaybar, and maybe even disconnect the front bar if you want to race it.

Can anyone prove if my theory about the rear bar and wheelspin is correct? Has anyone raced a 3rd gen in STS or FSP with a big rear bar and noticed a difference?


thanks,

Installshield

The cars you mentioned have larger front bars to help reduce oversteer, a huge inusurance problem for auto manufacturers. I believe every one of those cars has an LSD, at least in the higher trim models. So wheelspin is kept in check more by that than the bars...

I would think that putting a larger rear swaybar on a Protege would not correlate to insise wheel spin. This would allow for more oversteer, but would not keep the inside front wheel planted enough to provide traction. You could be correct, I am not positve about how they would relate, so someone that can please help me out...

Jas00x

----The cars you mentioned have larger front bars to help reduce oversteer, a huge inusurance problem for auto manufacturers. I believe every one of those cars has an LSD, at least in the higher trim models. So wheelspin is kept in check more by that than the bars...
---


Actually, the S2000 and MR2 Spyder do not have limited slips. I have driven both of these, Ian Stewart's S2000, and Eric Peterson's MR2-Spyder. Both are Nationally competitive Stock-Class autocross cars. Both cars have front bars over 1" thick. Yes they do have a tendency to oversteer, but for the most part, these guys use the big front bar to plant the rear wheels and put the power down- (reducing wheelspin). Most handling adjustments are made with shocks.
The fact that the MR2 does not have a limited slip is a reason why they have to run such a larger bar than the Miatas (that do have LSD's).

In any case, the 3rd Gen Protege does have a wheel spin problem. Putting a limited slip will help you out alot, but there may be other things you can do to prevent wheel spin just by modifying the suspension. If you are putting alot of power to a Protege, like a turbo or something, you probably will need a LSD and some Suspension mods like a big rear swaybar.

Installshield

Ok sorry about that, the only one I was positve about was the BMW...

Those cars are all RWD however, and a thick front bar will help the front bite and turn towards the apex better, which will make the car easier to rotate through the turn...

In any case the MR-2 has such a large front bar due to the mid engined chassis. Without adequate front anti roll, it would be way to *** happy for Toyota's lawyers...But it could be a combination of both...

I will try to keep this about protege's since that is what cars everyone is worried about: When you enter a turn hard, The outside tires take up the load and "corner" the car. The front inside tire is what is in question. If one would install a larger rear bar, it would prevent the rear from tucking in with the front and get "pulled" around the turn. In stock form the rear ends smaller bar allows more of the supension to take up the load of the turn and simply "roll" Installing a larger rear bar will result in the both rear tires keeping a more level contact patch and the rear end will "swing" around, and overdone results in oversteer. So the tires traction threshold is much easier to reach, being the the tires are taking more of the cornering force. Camber issues come directly into play with the oversteering too, but I won't get into that...

Its confusing to think of it as the front getting more traction, which I don't believe is the case. Its more of a change in the suspenion dynamics and behavior of the car. The rear will be easier to coax out and rotate with the car, rather than pushing the front end into a plow. I can't seem to get what I mean to make any sense. And again I am no suspension expert, so please fix any of this that is ignorant...

With all that, I don't see how a larger rear bar will decrease roll in the front and help with inside tire's traction. The front will more or less do the same as before. Stiff rear bar'ed FWDs still tuck in the nose when entering a turn by lifting the throttle and then lift the nose and widen the corner track when you mash it back down. I would think a combination of both front and rear bars will do more to help the front inside tire during cornering than just a rear. The larger front bar will prevent the front from rolling and lifting the inside tire, while the rear bar will allow the rear end to rotate around the turn without loading up the front too much and understeering...

Does this make any sense to you? I thougt I had an idea but the more I read this the less sense it makes....Please help me out...

Installshield

Thanks Jesse, I obviously overlooked some things...I knew some of it was off, but I could not figure out how to get some of that **** into words....