Just got a new P5!!
 

Just wanted to say hi to all you fellow P5 owners.
I just got mine last Friday, its a Classic Red beauty with just about all the options. Some guy had it ordered for him and then never came back to buy it.
Too bad for him, great for me!!
Only thing I don't have that I want is the moonroof deflector. I also got it tinted this past Saturday. Thankfully the weather has been holding out so I can still enjoy its looks before this year's blizzard hits! This is the first November in Buffalo's history where we haven't had any recordable snowfall. Bit o' trivia for ya! 'Course all that really means is that January is going to be HELL!!

One question though...
I have been thinking of either getting the car undercoated or Rustopped. I know the Rustop has to be reapplied each year and is some sort of oil coating on the underside of the car so it drips for about a week. Whereas the undercoating is a one time deal that has a lifetime warranty, but there has to be some sort of downside to undercoating too, isn't there? Otherwise wouldnt every body just get it undercoated once rather than take it back every year for the Rustop? Because that way the Rustop ends up costing quite a bit more in the long run.
Any suggestions?
Rustop approx. $100.00
Undercoating approx. $240.00

Congrats! and welcome... this a pretty cool forum...with alot of informed peeps

oh...and mine is silver...5 spd... a/c... moonroof...black bug/rock deflector... it goes in for tinting next week... and steel wheels and winter tires. Gonna need it...we got a foot of snow on the weekend...and it started again tonight.!

Ciao for now!

Congrats, Grind. I hope you like your P5 as much as I like mine!

I've said it in other threads, but I highly recommend the wind deflector for the moonroof, as it cuts the noise substantially.

My fiancee and myself just got our new protege5 last night! It's blue. It didn't come with a deflector, so we ordered one from mazdastuff.com last night.

Yes, I am definitely planning on getting the deflector as well, maybe for Christmas... if not, definitely in the spring. I'm in no really hurry seeing as how in about a week or two my car will be pretty much covered with snow just about every day till about March or April. So even if I wait till spring its no biggy to me.

So paulf, are you planning on getting the underside of your car treated at all? So far your the only other person who seems to have to actually worry about it like I do, if not more than I do!

oh yeah and, SALT SUCKS!!!!

I live in ontario canada, and as a metallurgist, I hate rust. So as a metallurgist here ya go. The problem with rust/under coating.

Why do cars rust? Salt? no. crappy steel? no. Condensation? YES!!!

Your car has a bunch of little nooks and crannies. Every time your car gets cold then warms up, your car sweats just like a cold glass of water on a hot day. This water then collectes even in small amounts over time in body panels, over and over and over. Even galvanized panels will start to rust at spot welds in 2-3 years. Undercoating will not get to these areas. it will simply covers the lower part of the car.

I personally use the type that drips. they go in to all the body panels, rockers, bumpers etc. Now I use Krown but most are the same. Krown is a hundred a year canadian, lifetime warranty, transferable with the car. If you ever look at how much fixing rust costs, it's peanuts to rust protection. (Salt and unprotected steel accerate the problem but do not cause it.)

My 2 cents take it or leave it.
Stocker

they don't salt the road that much here...mainly sand... sometimes all our snow melts even!! so Im not worried about it... in 3 years... I'll be in a new RX-8 or new "6"

hey stocker,
Firstly I don't think I fully understand your whole sweating like a cold glass of water on a hot day. The cold glass of water actually lowers the dew point temperature on the surrounding air and if the dew point gets too low and there is enough humidity in the air, the air can no onger support the humidity and must get rid of it, thats when condensation occurs. If you take the time to notice there will be less sweating on a glass on a dry hot day than on a humid, hot day. A car would be more like a hot glass of water on a cold day. And in that scenario, the car would give off steam, which would lift off of the car and exit into the surrounding atmosphere. Kinda like if you take some hot tea outside on a wintery day, the cup does not get wet it just gives off steam. Also, the engine is really the only thing that goes from cold to hot or vice versa, my question was really more for the entire underside of the car not just the engine.
Which really brings me back to my whole question of the best way to protect the underside of my car. From such things as water as well as salt. Which if I remember correctly from chemistry and physics classes, water and salt form ions when they combine, which then chemically react with the metal to form oxidation, ie. rust.
Salt may not be THE cause of rust but it is A cause of rust. Plus it gets all over the car and really makes it look like crap! Which is what really made me make the whole salt sucks comment.

oh and stocker,
please get back to me with your explanation, I dont mean to say you were wrong or anything, if you really are a metallurgist then you must know your stuff, eh?
Its just that now there are a few engineers here at the office that would like to know abou the whole sweating car thing as well. They are having trouble grasping it as well. For the same reasons as in my last post.

Also if anybody out there, has actually gotten either the oil/grease treatment or the rubber undercoating and has anything to say please let me know.

As part of the deal on my P5 it came with undercoating and the rust treatment. The one thing I did notice that road noise was reduced (I drove a P5 that didn't have it). My guess is that this is from the 'rubber' undercoating on the car.

A lot of people say that it isn't worth it, but when you live in such a harsh environment I can't think that it would hurt. I doubt that it will hurt resale as well.

Years ago I had an '81 Celica and it was undercoated (I can only assume when it was new). I owned the car from '91 to '98. Only in the last year did it start to develop rust, and even then it wasn't really all that severe. No holes in the fenders or anything. Was it the undercoating? Judging by the other Celica's of the same generation I have seen I'd say mine we remarkable.

Take that for what it's worth.

Jay

Hey, no problem
It is pretty easy to explain. I will use a common analogy.
When you walk outside in the morning you see dew on the grass. So why does water form on the grass? Well this thing people talk about called dew point is the main culprit. Depending on temperature, pressure and the amount of moisture in the air (humidity) there forms a temperature at which airborn water will condense to liquid water. Anything at a temperature below the dewpoint will form water on it, anything above the dewpoint won't. When the sun comes up in the morning it starts to warm up the atmosphere and the grass. Only the air warms up faster. As the air warms up, the dew point raises. So early in the morning the dew point might be at 15 degrees C, but the grass is still at 10C and the water condenses on the surface. Coincedentally your car is at ten degrees too. I am assuming you have walked out in the morning and found your car sopping wet before correct? You think it is only wet on the outside of the panel?

This is also why people who park in underground parking lots are worse off the the rest of us. The undergound parking lot is at a nice 20 degrees C, Dew point probably around 10. Well when you drive your cold car into the warm underground parking the car starts to "sweat". On top of that rust is thermally activated like most chemical reactions, so the less heat the better.

Does this help? I could get more technical if you like. But I find most people get lost. (or bored)
We have this problem with steel coils that are shipped out of cold storage sites during the summer.

Stocker

[B]hey stocker,
Firstly I don't think I fully understand your whole sweating like a cold glass of water on a hot day. The cold glass of water actually lowers the dew point temperature on the surrounding air and if the dew point gets too low and there is enough humidity in the air, the air can no onger support the humidity and must get rid of it, thats when condensation occurs. If you take the time to notice there will be less sweating on a glass on a dry hot day than on a humid, hot day. A car would be more like a hot glass of water on a cold day.

Your explanation is essentially correct. What you are missing is you are assuming your car is always warmer than the surrounding environment. This is not the case when the atmosphere warms up around your car. It is all relative. If your car is cold it acts like the glass of water. If you are fortunate enough to live in a dry climate, good for you. I live next to lake ontario. We routinely see 100% humidity in the summer. Not to mention huge temperature swings from day to night.

Salt may not be THE cause of rust but it is A cause of rust.

I am sorry, but the statement you made is incorrect. Salt is not a cause of rust. There is only one cause. Oxygen.
2Fe +3O2=Fe2O3 This is the formula for the rust that forms on your car. Salt will accelerate the process. If you toss some table salt on a peice of steel with out any oxygen, 100 years from now, you will have steel and salt. Add water, and you produce a free ion. Cl- now that clorine attacks your steel like Fe+2 + 2Cl- = FeCl2 THere are other things that go on but basically the clorine is stripping away the iron atom. The thing to remember is that you must keep the water from coming in contact with the metal. The under coating will protect the car mostly, and probably keep the salt away from the internal panels, but it wont keep your back hatch from rusting will it? Unless the under coat your hatch. It also won't prevent water from coming in contact with your internal panels. As our friend above said, his car lasted about 8 years. The oil spray companies will warrenty your car for life. All body panels, as long as you come back every year.



One other thing I like about the oil spray is that they do the internals of the frame too. Like I said I work for a company that sells steel to the auto industry. The body panels get all the nice galvanized material. But let me tell you, many many support peices like suspension components, brackets are made out of plain old steel. No oil, no zinc coatings, nothing. Trust me, they look like hell after 3 months. Especially in the winter.
What ever you do, if you live in a bad climate, do something. If not for yourself, for the next poor sucker that tries to loosen up a bolt on that suspension 10 years from now.

Cheers,
Ugh rereading this post reminds me why people find engineers boring.
Stocker

Hey stocker thanks for the explanation, I'll be sure to tell the 'neers tomorrow. (they all left early today, must be nice) I definitely see where your coming from with the sweating thing now. I still don't see how that would be the MAIN reason, as opposed to just driving thru slush all day, but hey you obviously know what your talking about.
Oh and thanks for pointing out to me why I only got a C in chemistry.
thanks again tho.

Hey, I went looking for someone that can explain the whole thing better than I can, it turns out Krown actually has a website that explains stuff pretty well. Some of it is scientifically inaccurate, but it gets the point across.

http://www.krown.ca/rust.htm

Cya